Saturday Discussion Thread

VirginiaCavs

VirginiaCavs

CTG Super Moderator
Staff member
May 14 Sat 2022

01:15 PM
901San Francisco GiantsJ. Junis -R+1½
-205		-101O 8
-110
902St. Louis CardinalsD. Hudson -R-1½
+175		-109U 8
-110
03:05 PM
903San Diego PadresS. Manaea -L+1½
-180		+116O 8
+100
904Atlanta BravesC. Morton -R-1½
+160		-126U 8
-120
03:07 PM
913Los Angeles Angels - Game #1J. Diaz -L-1½
+137		-117O 8
+100
914Oakland Athletics - Game #1P. Blackburn -R+1½
-157		+107U 8
-120
03:10 PM
915Baltimore OriolesB. Zimmermann -L+1½
-195		+105O 7½
-115
916Detroit TigersM. Pineda -R-1½
+170		-115U 7½
-105
05:10 PM
905Milwaukee BrewersE. Lauer -L-1½
+131		-131O 7
-110
906Miami MarlinsT. Rogers -L+1½
-151		+121U 7
-110
05:35 PM
907Cincinnati RedsL. Castillo -R-1½
+143		-114O 8
-105
908Pittsburgh PiratesZ. Thompson -R+1½
-163		+104U 8
-115
06:05 PM
927Houston AstrosC. Javier -R-1½
-105		-161O 8½
-125
928Washington NationalsE. Fedde -R+1½
-115		+148U 8½
+105
06:10 PM
921New York YankeesJ. Montgomery -L-1½
+105		-149O 8½
+100
922Chicago White SoxD. Keuchel -L+1½
-125		+138U 8½
-120
06:10 PM
929Seattle MarinersG. Kirby -R+143O 7½
-105
930New York MetsC. Bassitt -R-155U 7½
-115
07:10 PM
909Chicago CubsK. Hendricks -R+1½
-155		+130O 7½
-110
910Arizona DiamondbacksZ. Gallen -R-1½
+135		-141U 7½
-110
07:10 PM
931Kansas City RoyalsC. Hernandez -R+143O 10½
-110
932Colorado RockiesG. Marquez -R-155U 10½
-110
 
Shitty today. I liked yesterday wayyy better.
Rogers is my favorite play. I guess Manaea, Junis & Blackburn are playable. Maybe Castillo, small sample.
 
I think gotta play Gallon ov 6.5 k’s at even money. I normally don’t like venturing up to this number but the scrubbies got so much swing and miss vs rhp, they struck out 6x against freaking Davies yesterday! Long as gallon gets the innings he liable to rack up 9-10 k’s vs this lineup.
 
Can cardinals really avoid striking out another day? Against a dude who throw a whole bunch of sliders (seemingly some of them fav pitch to flail at off the plate!). Man I’m tempted to take another crack at Junis w plus money on 4.5, I do freaking hate they just saw him same as Webb tho.
 
I heard players complaining about the dead ball. Low scores were the norm to start the season. (Well. The A's been in a lot of low scoring games. No Offense, really good pitching.) Anyways... Now we are seeing 20+ runs in a game! Why? They switch balls?
 
If it weren’t for the absolute total gut wrencher loss on Astros O8 yesterday, I’d be on Cubs O8 today. Need to take a bit of a break on baseball overs after that.
 
Vap'sBack said:
I heard players complaining about the dead ball. Low scores were the norm to start the season. (Well. The A's been in a lot of low scoring games. No Offense, really good pitching.) Anyways... Now we are seeing 20+ runs in a game! Why? They switch balls?
Click to expand...
Hitters are actually learning to put the ball in play a month and a half into the season

Time to blame just how absolutely awful they've been as opposed to the balls
 
Vap'sBack said:
I heard players complaining about the dead ball. Low scores were the norm to start the season. (Well. The A's been in a lot of low scoring games. No Offense, really good pitching.) Anyways... Now we are seeing 20+ runs in a game! Why? They switch balls?
Click to expand...

Def something there. Just look at the HR rates.
 
Inspekdah said:
Def something there. Just look at the HR rates.
Click to expand...
That's the problem that I've seen though. You can't sell me on some conspiracy that MLB wants less HR, that's the only reason people watch anymore outside of gambling. They NEED homeruns. Problem is these hitters know it and have graduated to the all or nothing type swings. They aren't hitting anymore, MLB has basically turned into a long drive contest.

What would possibly be gained by anyone intentionally lowering the HR rates?
 
KJ said:
That's the problem that I've seen though. You can't sell me on some conspiracy that MLB wants less HR, that's the only reason people watch anymore outside of gambling. They NEED homeruns. Problem is these hitters know it and have graduated to the all or nothing type swings. They aren't hitting anymore, MLB has basically turned into a long drive contest.

What would possibly be gained by anyone intentionally lowering the HR rates?
Click to expand...

Have to ditch the shift. Only way to save the sport. People want to see 3-4 .300 hitters in a lineup. .230 should be an awful average. Batting champ should be .370. Not .317.
 
Inspekdah said:
Have to ditch the shift. Only way to save the sport. People want to see 3-4 .300 hitters in a lineup. .230 should be an awful average. Batting champ should be .370. Not .317.
Click to expand...
I'd rather they take away a fielder altogether than get rid of the shift. That will be a shitshow all around. Just like the old NBA not allowing the zone. Defense is half the game, if you can't figure out how to play offense against a creative defense, you need to play another sport. Golf actually makes sense, the defense doesn't move in golf.
 
KJ said:
I'd rather they take away a fielder altogether than get rid of the shift. That will be a shitshow all around. Just like the old NBA not allowing the zone. Defense is half the game, if you can't figure out how to play offense against a creative defense, you need to play another sport. Golf actually makes sense, the defense doesn't move in golf.
Click to expand...

Just have to stay on your side of second base. They aren’t getting rid of a position.
 
Inspekdah said:
Just have to stay on your side of second base. They aren’t getting rid of a position.
Click to expand...
That's my point, who's judgment call is "side of 2nd base" and when does apply? Pre-pitch, when the ball crosses the plate? When you're backing up a throw on a SB attempt?

Whole thing is idiotic. Learn to hit. I hate long drive contests and even used to be good at them, but telling hitters where fielders have to stand has to be the dumbest thing to ever happen in sport if it does happen, worse than replay on pass interference. Learn to hit or don't play.

Rather baseball just die off into oblivion than telling a defender where to play. I'm down with all 7 in the field on the left side if some meathead only knows how to crank balls to LF
 
I also like the choice of playing 4 outfielders, how does this shift thing work then?
 
It’s a done deal. Players want it. TV wants it. They just need to speed up the game. Probably raise the mound too. Over unders will be 9.5/10
 
Inspekdah said:
2 on each side of second on contact.
Click to expand...
Restricting defense is restricting sport and intelligence. Who determines the line? I want three in left field and one handling all of right.

Zero way that's good, ratings wouldn't increase for that trash. No shift? That has to be a joke if they're trying to do it. Learn to hit. Or play golf.
 
KJ said:
Restricting defense is restricting sport and intelligence. Who determines the line? I want three in left field and one handling all of right.

Zero way that's good, ratings wouldn't increase for that trash. No shift? That has to be a joke if they're trying to do it. Learn to hit. Or play golf.
Click to expand...

It’s a done deal. And it will be good when your favorite player is batting .350 instead of .250.
 
But I actually enjoy situational hitting. Watching pull hitters all day would be a buzz kill if that's their only skill.
 
Back to a shitty sports morning, put a small bet on Junis o3.5 ks -140. Nothing earth shattering.
 
Inspekdah said:
It’s a done deal. Players want it. TV wants it. They just need to speed up the game. Probably raise the mound too. Over unders will be 9.5/10
Click to expand...
It’ll be interesting to see those lines at the start of the season. Books will either set them too high or too low
 
Ryno14 said:
It’ll be interesting to see those lines at the start of the season. Books will either set them too high or too low
Click to expand...
Seriously is there going to be another chalk line from 2nd to the CF fence? How will they judge which side of 2nd someone is on? Pitch clock has been good, this no shift thing is awful.
 
You know what would make it fun @Inspekdah

Integrate it with soccer rules. No more than three replacements per game....or use that as a starting point, allow for another for injury or something. Nothing slows the game down more than pitching changes and now that they've already eliminated the ultimate challenge in the NL with pitchers hitting, allow for limited changes. Make managers manage.
 
KJ said:
Seriously is there going to be another chalk line from 2nd to the CF fence? How will they judge which side of 2nd someone is on? Pitch clock has been good, this no shift thing is awful.
Click to expand...

Pretty sure it’s not even up for debate anymore. It’s a done deal.
 
Inspekdah said:
I meant I think it’s not even up for debate with the baseball powers. They just didn’t have the time with the lockout to do it for 2022.
Click to expand...
The one thing that keeps baseball relevant to the younger generations imo is thinking, not offense. Hell our generation even (not sure how old you are) but the challenge of the sport is the bloodline imo. In any sport. Take that away and who wouldn't rather play video games, or even spend an hour walking the dog? Restricting strategy is a very poor move.
 
The problem with the shift is it forces hitters to hit to a certain spot. The pitcher than can throw pitches to try to keep them into the shift and some hitters are just physically built to hit it 70% of the time one direction. It’s a huge advantage. I have no problem getting rid of it. Don’t turn baseball into the neutral zone trap era of the nhl.
 
Smokeshow99 said:
The problem with the shift is it forces hitters to hit to a certain spot. The pitcher than can throw pitches to try to keep them into the shift and some hitters are just physically built to hit it 70% of the time one direction. It’s a huge advantage. I have no problem getting rid of it. Don’t turn baseball into the neutral zone trap era of the nhl.
Click to expand...
Why Tony Gwynn was much more relevant than Jose Canseco or Mark McGuire

Again, I don't need to see anyone hand fed to their strengths....go down this road and baseball is less relevant than bowling
 
And if you're so tough at hitting to a spot, beat the shift. It happens frequently.
 
I'm amazed that you guys are so seriously against quality pitching. Those guys study daily to beat their opponents. So screw that.

Put it on a tee then.
 
KJ said:
And if you're so tough at hitting to a spot, beat the shift. It happens frequently.
Click to expand...

Could you imagine what Tony Gwynn would hit against the shift? Mfer woulda been a lifetime .400 hitter! I’m with you, the problem isn’t the shift, it the fact every hitter is now programmed to swing for the fences every pitch which is why the shift works. It would be a terrible strategy if hitters would go back to learning the art of hitting opposed to hitting for power. I don’t think the correct answer is handcuffing a defense or pitcher cause they choosing to take that lame ass approach at the plate!
 
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Inspekdah said:
It’s a done deal. And it will be good when your favorite player is batting .350 instead of .250.
Click to expand...

I don’t think it good to hand them hits they don’t earn, it would be good if they would stop swinging for the fences regardless of count or situation. I don’t think it real fair they get to keep using this approach, which is to blame for their poor averages, so they can generate more power but not suffer the consequences of being incredibly predictable where they gonna hit the ball. If you tried to shift on the great hitters of the past they would be on base over 50% of the time!
 
2daBank said:
Could you imagine what Tony Gwynn would hit against the shift? Mfer woulda been a lifetime .400 hitter! I’m with you, the problem isn’t the shift, it the fact every hitter is now programmed to swing for the fences every pitch which is why the shift works. It would be a terrible strategy if hitters would go back to learning the art of hitting opposed to hitting for power. I don’t think the correct answer is handcuffing a defense or pitcher cause they choosing to take that lame ass approach at the plate!
Click to expand...
And I get his point but who the fuck is watching more baseball just because the less than adaptable "athletes" somehow get some advantage so we see 12 runs/game than 8? Again, no kid gives a flyin' fuck about runs, they want strategy unless you really think they're stupid. If so, it's not a sport. It's a game. Like Uno.
 
Worst thing sport in general can do these days is disengage with strategy, they should be thriving on it but completely going backwards

Challenge the brain, if you don't, you become irrelevant
 
KJ said:
And I get his point but who the fuck is watching more baseball just because the less than adaptable "athletes" somehow get some advantage so we see 12 runs/game than 8? Again, no kid gives a flyin' fuck about runs, they want strategy unless you really think they're stupid. If so, it's not a sport. It's a game. Like Uno.
Click to expand...

I think it crazy to reward them for not taking a better approach at the plate. So instead of having to stop swinging for fences every time we just gonna reward them for it when they don’t achieve the launch angle they need? That silly. Those batting average climbs with be fraudulent and pitchers gonna have a miserable time if guys allowed to continue with this same approach and getting rewarded with a hit when they fail! That why the shift is so effective, cause we know exactly what they doing and where ball will go if they don’t accomplish it! We should be encouraging them to choke up and/or hit to opposite field, not making it easier to continue swinging out their shoes every pitch!
 
Back when it was embarrassing to strike out this much the shift would have been a blessing to a hitter who protecting the plate w 2 strikes! It be really easy to discourage shifting the right way, you know how many pitchers be furious when they start giving up weak ass hits every time the hitter down 1-2 and just slaps it thru that huge hole!
 
Anyways back to the games. I absolutely hate kuechal but I do like the idea of getting that much plus money on the chisox when facing a lefty! The over feels almost too easy with the way this series been going. I think best thing for me is CWS team total over 3.5 runs, that way I can take their bats vs a lefty and not worry bout what kuechal does!
 
I’m not gonna make it back up to casino before 1st pitch but Lauer ov 6.5 k’s vs fish lineup who swings and misses a ton vs lefties is prob a good play.
 
ranger Suarez over 15.5 outs. Lad lineup scares me but they have never been as effective vs lhp. I’ve never been as high on this kid as many have so I’m a bit torn. They have no problem letting him throw upwards of 100 pitches so long as he effective enough they surely gonna leave him out there long as possible w the beating the pen has took this series. He been best on 4 days rest, when they 1st brought him into the rotation last year he went 4.1 effective innings vs dodgers he just hadn’t been fully stretched out yet, he is now and think he more than capable of going the 5.1 we need to take the cash.
 
This is one of the shittiest sports days in a while outside of hockey and anything else seems forced

Roof closed in PHX tonight (and tomorrow), think Gallen can go deep, rather his outs than ks but most could hit. Nice +1.5/u8 parlay at +216 seems legit too
 
A lot of casual fans constantly think the automatic out over second, and the 3 second basemens, sucks.

Whether we like it or not it’s likely gone. And teams like the As and Rays who thrived on leading analytics will need to have actual players vs advanced shift strategies.
 
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