NBA Finals Discussion thread

nbafan88 said:
What is this referring to? MVP?
Click to expand...

Pop comparision.
There is style of basketball. Thib's, Jackson's, Pop's, D'Antoni's and so on...
Blatt and Messina believe in the same style of basketball as Pop and know how to implement it as well.
 
divol said:
Again, I'm talking about style of basketball. Not the charisma and everything else. Purely style of basketball.
No one is bigger than the team, looking for the hot hand, ball movement and so on...
Click to expand...
I don't think they match....

"looking for the hot hand"

you think POP would sit Mozgov with how he has performed in the NBA finals? I don't think so, He was the next productive player they had after Bron and the pick and roll they were running with him was deadly...I think the whole player pressure thing came into play here when the team came out saying they want the vets to play. Blatt seems like a people pleaser to me, maybe i'm reading him wrong.
 
I don't think Blatt is that type, but I do think he froze more than once in the NBA Finals.
And I honestly don't know if Pop would sit Mozgov.
When he pulled out Timmy not once, but twice in the final seconds, when in both times, Heat scored three pointer after offensive rebound, I couldn't believe it was Pop that was coaching the Spurs...
 
And don't forget that players between themselves and Bron to the media, all told that Marion should play as well. Dumbest thing I heard and Blatt ignored it.
Miller was the right move.
Playing with only one day of rest and flight in the middle, just imagine Miller's 17 minutes going to other Cleveland players...
Blatt was and still desperate for the instant offense and Miller is easier to hide on defense than Mozgov and he is better passer.
Btw, I read really great article in Russian, about how Kerr adjusted his defense against Mozgov in Game 5 and that's another reason why Blatt had no choice, but to sit him.
Mozgov played 9 minutes and scored zero...
 
divol said:
Pop comparision.
There is style of basketball. Thib's, Jackson's, Pop's, D'Antoni's and so on...
Blatt and Messina believe in the same style of basketball as Pop and know how to implement it as well.
Click to expand...


First...Don't you hate the spurs?


second.... I have popovich up there as the best coach of all time (or at least however long ive been alive because i don't go back and research coaches)

stating that you think he can be the next popovich is like me saying that a player out of college is going to be the next Jordan... its just farfetched and not even worth discussing until he achieves anything noteworthy
 
Early action

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712 Cleveland Cavaliers
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twinkie13 said:
I have heard this as well though Lar....

hasn't this been talked about?
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Yeah, wasn't it talked about back in December when they started slow and the media acted as if Blatt and LeBron hate each other? Why in the hell would be be fired at this point?
 
gsro said:
I don't think I'm on a crackpipe, I think there's a difference between calling Blatt the best coach ever/the next POP than it is to say that he could be fired.

I don't see Bron and Blatt getting along eventually like Spoe and Bron did...Bron has the final say and it's obvious they clash...you going to keep bron happy or blatt? Just my 0.02 cents


Also throughout the thread, it's been spoken to but when they win it's Bron and not Blatt and when they lose it's Blatt and not Bron you can't have it both ways, someone's going to be a scapegoat and I don't think Cavs are going to pitt it on LeBron...you guys have said it, Bron controls everything
Click to expand...

I agree about Bron getting the credit for doing the coaching when they win, and Blatt getting the blame when they lose (on here), I was going to say the same thing myself.

What I don't understand is why you think that outside of CTG, why someone would have to be "the scapegoat" if the Cavs end up losing the series. They are in a Game 6 of the NBA Finals with 2 of their 3 best players not playing due to injury. If they lose, why would someone have to be fired, or held accountable? There's not much shame in losing in the Finals, and it's certianly nowhere near something that a coach would lose his job over. It literally makes no sense to me at all...why do you feel like he'd be even up for consideration of being fired?
 
Who said now that Blatt's job is in jeopardy? He's done a great job dealing with the adversity the season has brought him. Who's saying otherwise?
 
nbafan88 said:
If Lebron wants him gone, he'll be gone.
Click to expand...

According to many guys on here, LeBron already runs the team...why would he want Blatt gone when he's in charge anyway? Y'all think Bron just tells management to go without a coach since it seemingly doesn't matter anywa because he'll be the de-facto coach?
 
You need to stop playing forum police and just interact like one of us Lareux

when I say Lebron runs the organization I don't literally mean it. I mean his influence on the decisions the organization makes is far greater than any other NBA players influence to his team. This is obvious. It's just how it is when you're worth as much to the organization as he is.
 
nbafan88 said:
Who said now that Blatt's job is in jeopardy? He's done a great job dealing with the adversity the season has brought him. Who's saying otherwise?
Click to expand...

Post 1567, gsro said he has a feeling Blatt will be gone. Then Twinkie chimed in that it's been brought up before and he's heard people talking about it. Granted, the talk was back in December/January, but that never stopped anyone from spreading rumors I guess.
 
Lareux said:
I agree about Bron getting the credit for doing the coaching when they win, and Blatt getting the blame when they lose (on here), I was going to say the same thing myself.

What I don't understand is why you think that outside of CTG, why someone would have to be "the scapegoat" if the Cavs end up losing the series. They are in a Game 6 of the NBA Finals with 2 of their 3 best players not playing due to injury. If they lose, why would someone have to be fired, or held accountable? There's not much shame in losing in the Finals, and it's certianly nowhere near something that a coach would lose his job over. It literally makes no sense to me at all...why do you feel like he'd be even up for consideration of being fired?
Click to expand...

I think it was a rushed hire by the Cavs, I don't think LeBron is a big fan of him and had the Cavs known James was coming back they would have held off on the hiring process...is the success of the cavs to the finals a culmination of the shitty east + Bron or the shitty east + Blatt+ Bron. I think it's Bron + East heck of a player coach and the players listen to him more than they do Blatt. I mean in Dec/Jan there was rumblings of his job and Gilbert came out and said that he doesn't feel firing mid-season was right and that he deserved one season maybe a second.
 
nbafan88 said:
You need to stop playing forum police and just interact like one of us Lareux
Click to expand...

How am I playing forum police? Someone made a statement and I discussed it. Just like you're doing with Divol and his Blatt comments....what's the difference?
 
Lareux said:
According to many guys on here, LeBron already runs the team...why would he want Blatt gone when he's in charge anyway? Y'all think Bron just tells management to go without a coach since it seemingly doesn't matter anywa because he'll be the de-facto coach?
Click to expand...
you keep your star happy, they wont' eff up and lose him over a coach if it came down to it...that is the biggest difference between Miami and Cleveland though...Riley would only take so much shit.
 
“It really didn’t,” Gilbert told NEOMG. “I don’t care what the expectations were, especially after we changed coaches twice in two years. This was a guy with a long-term record of success. You have to at least give a season, maybe more than just one. I think it would have destabilized the entire franchise and it would have been bad
 
Wanna dig up the comments from LeBron where he says there is no issue with him and Blatt, that he likes him as a coach, and thinks he's done a good job too?
 
nbafan88 said:
You need to stop playing forum police and just interact like one of us Lareux

when I say Lebron runs the organization I don't literally mean it. I mean his influence on the decisions the organization makes is far greater than any other NBA players influence to his team. This is obvious. It's just how it is when you're worth as much to the organization as he is.
Click to expand...

I wasn't even referring to you with that comment, I was talking about guys saying LeBron is coaching the team not running the organization. What you've said is true, and I agree.
 
gsro said:
I think it was a rushed hire by the Cavs, I don't think LeBron is a big fan of him and had the Cavs known James was coming back they would have held off on the hiring process...is the success of the cavs to the finals a culmination of the shitty east + Bron or the shitty east + Blatt+ Bron. I think it's Bron + East heck of a player coach and the players listen to him more than they do Blatt. I mean in Dec/Jan there was rumblings of his job and Gilbert came out and said that he doesn't feel firing mid-season was right and that he deserved one season maybe a second.
Click to expand...

No doubt. Had they known Bron was coming, they would have waited on him and talked to him before hiring. Maybe they would have went with Blatt anyway, but if Bron was a part of that decision, he would have treated Blatt different.
As for players listening to Blatt, I feel that Thompson, Delli and Kyrie are Blatt's players and wouldn't want him replaced with anyone else. Mozgov owes his NBA career to Blatt. Blatt chose him over few good Russian Centers to go to EC and played him just right to earn him a contract with the Knicks. Both spoke very highly of each other before Mozgov's trade and Blatt asked for him since the moment he was hired.

On the other side there is Bron, who is known to treat coaches like sh*t as Windhorst said and we all knew anyway. I assume that Smith, as Bron's good friend is on his side and maybe Shumpert as well.

Love... hard to tell... He can't be happy with Blatt, after everything Blatt put him through, but on the other side, he always had very high praises for him, so who knows...

Btw, do you think he would had more respect towards his coaches if he spent a season or two in college? I think it would have. College coaches are absolutely different animal than NBA coaches as far as power goes and Bron would have learned to respect coaches I think.

Blatt is very mediocre in game coach, but amazing at getting his teams ready for big game/ games. He also has a problem with star players or at least feels a lot better coaching a team with 7 - 9 more or less equal players, than to coach a team of one/ two huge names + scrubs.
 
Lareux said:
Wanna dig up the comments from LeBron where he says there is no issue with him and Blatt, that he likes him as a coach, and thinks he's done a good job too?
Click to expand...
I'm not sure if this is hostility but, I stated I have a feeling that Blatt may be gone after this season, I stated why and if you dont' agree that's fine but doesn't make me any less right or wrong?

Sure he's done a good job, good job ruining Bron's knees....who the hell is going to say their coach did a shit job going to the Finals? But if it's not for the East and Lebron I think the Cavs would have been a fringe 8-10
 
Too bad I can't find a link to Griffin's interview, where in part, he talks about Blatt and how he sees things...

Here is nice article about Blatt and Cavs in general:
In all the exuberance about the performances of LeBron James and his rag-tag crew of Cavs, virtually zero credit is being given to the head coach, David Blatt. We covered this topic a couple weeks ago, when Blatt seemed resigned to this reality, and decided to just go along with it and be LeBron’s hype man. But, the phenomenon has become even more pronounced.
For example, Adrian Wojnarowski wrote a piece this past January which (rightfully, at the time)criticized LeBron’s leadership of the Cavs and treatment of Blatt:
For everyone suspicious of James’ intentions when he pushed David Blatt out of a confrontation with a game official in Tuesday night’s loss to the Phoenix Suns, give James a benefit of the doubt he hasn’t earned. He was trying to spare Blatt a technical foul. In this warped Cavaliers culture, it almost felt like progress in the limited star-coach partnership. At least, James acknowledged that Blatt was there, that he was Cavaliers coach. That’s been rare.

After last night’s game, Woj wrote a 1,200+ word column rightfully singing LeBron’s virtues. David Blatt’s name came up zero times. This is not to say the coaching staff got zero credit — Cavs general manager David Griffin was quoted in the piece praising the assistant who saved the team from Blatt’s phantom technical in Game 4 against the Bulls:
“There’s the guy right there,” Griffin said in the corridor outside the Cavaliers office, talking loudly so associate head coach Ty Lue, the defensive coordinator, could hear him. Lue had his travel bag over his shoulder, and a smile on his face.

It’s not just Woj, and this is not meant to pick on him. Our site’s recap of the game praised LeBron and Matthew Dallavedova, but had no mention of Blatt. Deadspin devoted a piece this morning to the Cavs’ team defense where Blatt’s name appeared zero times (though another post of theirs did give Blatt credit for the defensive schemes). To be fair, Blatt was also praised by Zach Lowe andBrian Windhorst.
It’s interesting that while Blatt’s name was by-and-large excluded from commentary after Game 2’s victory, he almost assuredly would’ve been excoriated for leaving Timofey Mozgov on the bench if the Warriors had mounted a successful comeback. It’s a situation unlike anything I can remember, except maybe when Jim Caldwell was the nominal coach of Peyton Manning and the Colts. As frustrating as that must be, it’s still probably worth it to be along for the ride.
Click to expand...
 
Too bad I can't find a link to Griffin's interview, where in part, he talks about Blatt and how he sees things...

Here is nice article about Blatt and Cavs in general:
In all the exuberance about the performances of LeBron James and his rag-tag crew of Cavs, virtually zero credit is being given to the head coach, David Blatt. We covered this topic a couple weeks ago, when Blatt seemed resigned to this reality, and decided to just go along with it and be LeBron’s hype man. But, the phenomenon has become even more pronounced.
For example, Adrian Wojnarowski wrote a piece this past January which (rightfully, at the time)criticized LeBron’s leadership of the Cavs and treatment of Blatt:
For everyone suspicious of James’ intentions when he pushed David Blatt out of a confrontation with a game official in Tuesday night’s loss to the Phoenix Suns, give James a benefit of the doubt he hasn’t earned. He was trying to spare Blatt a technical foul. In this warped Cavaliers culture, it almost felt like progress in the limited star-coach partnership. At least, James acknowledged that Blatt was there, that he was Cavaliers coach. That’s been rare.

After last night’s game, Woj wrote a 1,200+ word column rightfully singing LeBron’s virtues. David Blatt’s name came up zero times. This is not to say the coaching staff got zero credit — Cavs general manager David Griffin was quoted in the piece praising the assistant who saved the team from Blatt’s phantom technical in Game 4 against the Bulls:
“There’s the guy right there,” Griffin said in the corridor outside the Cavaliers office, talking loudly so associate head coach Ty Lue, the defensive coordinator, could hear him. Lue had his travel bag over his shoulder, and a smile on his face.

It’s not just Woj, and this is not meant to pick on him. Our site’s recap of the game praised LeBron and Matthew Dallavedova, but had no mention of Blatt. Deadspin devoted a piece this morning to the Cavs’ team defense where Blatt’s name appeared zero times (though another post of theirs did give Blatt credit for the defensive schemes). To be fair, Blatt was also praised by Zach Lowe andBrian Windhorst.
It’s interesting that while Blatt’s name was by-and-large excluded from commentary after Game 2’s victory, he almost assuredly would’ve been excoriated for leaving Timofey Mozgov on the bench if the Warriors had mounted a successful comeback. It’s a situation unlike anything I can remember, except maybe when Jim Caldwell was the nominal coach of Peyton Manning and the Colts. As frustrating as that must be, it’s still probably worth it to be along for the ride.
Click to expand...
 
gsro said:
I'm not sure if this is hostility but, I stated I have a feeling that Blatt may be gone after this season, I stated why and if you dont' agree that's fine but doesn't make me any less right or wrong?

Sure he's done a good job, good job ruining Bron's knees....who the hell is going to say their coach did a shit job going to the Finals? But if it's not for the East and Lebron I think the Cavs would have been a fringe 8-10
Click to expand...

You really think that any other coach would have been able to play Bron 40 minutes or less in this series?
 
gsro said:
do you really think that Blatt is a godsend to the NBA?
Click to expand...

No, but I just don't see how Cleveland, with their roster, could give Bron 40 minutes or less.
I still believe that Blatt could give him 1 - 2 more minutes of rest and he chose in Game 5 very poor timing to do so (but didn't pay for that).

I also do believe that NBA is long due for a European coach and Blatt, as "Euro - American" probably the best candidate for that and deserves a fair chance.
 
I will admit when I'm wrong, my finger should be pointing at Griffin more than Blatt with the roster, but to elaborate it's not just this finals that's ruining it, it's cementing it....5 straight ECFS and now running him hard to win and I'm sure he doesn't want to sit either.
 
Lareux said:
Wanna dig up the comments from LeBron where he says there is no issue with him and Blatt, that he likes him as a coach, and thinks he's done a good job too?
Click to expand...

But what else do you expect him to say? Like do you actually expect anything else?

same thing with Love staying with the team.... It's the political answer. I don't think love is comfortable in this offense. Doesn't seem like he's willing to sacrifice his personal stats like Bosh had to do. I don't think love is that great of player. His stats are somewhat fluff in my eyes and I would not want him on my team if I was running an organization
 
The NBA is eventually going to be headed to Europe in a much bigger way. The game has expanded there and it's inevitable. It has the ability to expand like no other league in America because of the exposure of the league and the sport being much more international than football or baseball

Having said this.... European players are the reason flopping has become so prevalent in the NBA and for that I will never forgive.
:enraged:
 
I think that Love has no reason to leave now. Next season is when the contracts will go up and he is best to stay next to Bron and try to win a title.
After all, if we assume that Cleveland will be healthier next year + can trade Haywood for a good player, they will be in the NBA Finals again.

I can't see Hawks or Bulls getting better than this year. Wizards and Pacers got a shot, but it's a long road for both imho before being ready to take down Cleveland.
 
gsro said:
I'm not sure if this is hostility but, I stated I have a feeling that Blatt may be gone after this season, I stated why and if you dont' agree that's fine but doesn't make me any less right or wrong?

Sure he's done a good job, good job ruining Bron's knees....who the hell is going to say their coach did a shit job going to the Finals? But if it's not for the East and Lebron I think the Cavs would have been a fringe 8-10
Click to expand...

No hostility at all. We are adults, we are having a discussion. You dug up a quote from around Christmas to support your opinion...I simply asked if you'd care to dig up the quotes from LeBron that wouldn't support your opinion.
 
nbafan88 said:
But what else do you expect him to say? Like do you actually expect anything else?

same thing with Love staying with the team.... It's the political answer. I don't think love is comfortable in this offense. Doesn't seem like he's willing to sacrifice his personal stats like Bosh had to do. I don't think love is that great of player. His stats are somewhat fluff in my eyes and I would not want him on my team if I was running an organization
Click to expand...

There are ways to avoid questions altogether or give cryptic type answers...Bron did none of that. Maybe he isn't being honest, but if the contention is that players always say the expected answer, I would, again, question why anyone cares what any athlete says at any time.
 
We are giving our opinion on what see between the interaction/lack of interaction between the players/coaches

you yourself said the post game conferences mean nothing.... What's different between that and any quotes you get from Lebron?
 
divol said:
Good question. The same goes for Mozgov and Varejao. The problem is that both Love and Varejao are injury prone...
Click to expand...

Varejao days as a starter are gone. I love the guys hustle but he shouldn't be playing more than 15 minutes a night
 
And i would much rather have Thompson than Love if I were the Cavs. You don't need Love when you have Lebron. That was one of the issues people had... Love isn't really the same type of player we bosh
 
nbafan88 said:
We are giving our opinion on what see between the interaction/lack of interaction between the players/coaches

you yourself said the post game conferences mean nothing.... What's different between that and any quotes you get from Lebron?
Click to expand...

I never said there was for starters. I simply used the same quotes that others want to use...and when I use them it becomes "well of course he said that." Don't you see the irony? It's the same irony being used to say LeBron coaches the team when they win, but Blatt should be blamed when they lose. Lotta guys on here just can't be wrong and it shows in their childish posts (not you).

But, quotes from guys at post game pressers, mere minutes after the battle, and in answer to the same mundane questions, are certainly different than a normal interview, or can be different in many cases. I mentioned that last night.
 
divol said:
If Cleveland win the title, Bron is the MVP, if GSW wins the title it's Curry.
They won't give the MVP to anyone on the losing team...
Click to expand...

It might be way before our lifetimes but it has happened before.

nbafan88 said:
ArizonaKid hopes you're wrong
Click to expand...

Rooting for AK, sick bet.

divol said:
The idea to give MVP to a player on a losing team is absurd imho.
It simply belittles everyone but him. It also will be very strange moment to give MVP to LeBron, when he and the rest of the players in the locker room demoralized by the loss and GSW players celebrating outside.
Click to expand...

This would be awesome to watch, lol.

nbafan88 said:
It's not absurd when Lebron is the most valuable player to his team in the finals. What's happening right now is historic.
Click to expand...

The numbers are simply historic. I'll throw out the shooting percentage because he has to.

I love that Bron was finally put into a situation where he has to go 'all out' in every phase each game of a series.




Remember years back I said Bron should average close to a triple-double...well...this is as close as we will see...he is leaving it all out there...
 
nbafan88 said:
And i would much rather have Thompson than Love if I were the Cavs. You don't need Love when you have Lebron. That was one of the issues people had... Love isn't really the same type of player we bosh
Click to expand...
Put in Love instead of Thompson in this series and maybe, just maybe, Cleveland are up 3 - 2 after Game 5 and not the other way around.
You can see how spacing is an issue for Cleveland in this series...
 
divol said:
If Cleveland win the title, Bron is the MVP, if GSW wins the title it's Curry.
They won't give the MVP to anyone on the losing team...
Click to expand...

nbafan88 said:
ArizonaKid hopes you're wrong
Click to expand...

divol said:
The idea to give MVP to a player on a losing team is absurd imho.
It simply belittles everyone but him. It also will be very strange moment to give MVP to LeBron, when he and the rest of the players in the locker room demoralized by the loss and GSW players celebrating outside.
Click to expand...

divol said:
It was the first time that MVP ever was handed (and I think there is a reason they tried it the first time and not once since that).
Click to expand...


I would hae to look through closer but I don't believe there has been a reason to give it to another player from losing team since.

Curry needs an epic Game 6 to grab it, imo. He had a couple of awful games in this series(to his standard).
 
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