Michigan cheating…

this is amateur shit
A city councilman that graduated from Odessa High brought up charges that a Permian player lived on the wrong street corner . Permian was undefeated(or one loss) and off a state championship.
Stripped of their wins. Been 30 years so may not remember exactly, but Texas High school is ruthless.
had to forfeit after winning the first playoff game.
 
pressitup said:
this is amateur shit
A city councilman that graduated from Odessa High brought up charges that a Permian player lived on the wrong street corner . Permian was undefeated(or one loss) and off a state championship.
Stripped of their wins. Been 30 years so may not remember exactly, but Texas High school is ruthless.
had to forfeit after winning the first playoff game.
Click to expand...

We had the same thing here a couple of years ago. Undefeated state champ using an ineligible player. He said he moved. Was just an empty apartment no one ever lived at.
 
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cubsker said:
We had the same thing here a couple of years ago. Undefeated state champ using an ineligible player. He said he moved. Was just an empty apartment no one ever lived at.
Click to expand...
well the permian player lived in the house, but the councilman pulled some zoning shit . the kid lived/ moved in with his grandparents or vice versa and the home was zoned OHS.
so he started in phs, moved and the corner was verbotin
no one said shit until they made the playoffs
 
That's how this was. Waited until it was all over and then I think someone that lost in the semis threw the fit.
 
That happens here in Michigan too. Team got stripped of state titles for players living with the coach and not using his address for a residence...something weird like that.
 
pressitup said:
this is amateur shit
A city councilman that graduated from Odessa High brought up charges that a Permian player lived on the wrong street corner . Permian was undefeated(or one loss) and off a state championship.
Stripped of their wins. Been 30 years so may not remember exactly, but Texas High school is ruthless.
had to forfeit after winning the first playoff game.
Click to expand...
A high school in Gulf Shores AL is under investigation for a booster paying the rent for 4 families that had a football player transfer in during the last year. There's a reason the southern schools are generally better. We start our cheating a lot earlier lol
 
Marsski said:
I think the NCAA hits them with the ol' loss of institutional control and gives Jim Harbaugh a show cause penalty and he leaves Michigan. He tries to leave every year anyway.
Click to expand...
A view from another Buckeye fan here, while trying to evalute what the NCAA might do, will do, or won't do. The one thing that is flying in the face of some of my opinions are the current odds. Michigan's Nat'l Title odds have gotten shorter, not longer. 'Some' of this I think ties into Georgia's (relative) struggles and the key Brock Bowers injury. But it's clear that oddsmakers don't feel that Michigan got much of a bump from the sign stealing.....at least in terms of this year's team. Then, you have the look-ahead/Games of the Year/whatever you want to call it line on The Game in November. FanDuel and others had that as Michigan -4.5 before last Saturday's games. After Ohio St beat Penn State and Michigan hammered Sparty, FanDuel moved that to -7 -115 Sunday morning. Later Sunday, they lowered it to UM -6.5 -110, but that spread has stuck since late Sunday. BetRivers is currently mimicking those -6.5 -115 numbers. [Correction: currently mimicking the -6.5 -110 numbers]

Now, damning stories of this ordeal are coming out multiple times a day on this, IMO. So maybe that will move this toward a faster decision. But right now, I just don't see any key decisions being made until after mid-Jan. The NCAA almost always moves at snail's pace, and then you have the tea leaves from the oddsmakers/bettors I mentioned above.

Now, I don't know some of the key dynamics of the NC Title odds....like, what would the books do if Michigan is ruled ineligible for the CFB Playoff? Would they treat those at losses for those who bet Michigan or would they return their money? Obviously that's rather key in understanding what the odds might or might not be indicating.
 
Buck50 said:
A view from another Buckeye fan here, while trying to evalute what the NCAA might do, will do, or won't do. The one thing that is flying in the face of some of my opinions are the current odds. Michigan's Nat'l Title odds have gotten shorter, not longer. 'Some' of this I think ties into Georgia's (relative) struggles and the key Brock Bowers injury. But it's clear that oddsmakers don't feel that Michigan got much of a bump from the sign stealing.....at least in terms of this year's team. Then, you have the look-ahead/Games of the Year/whatever you want to call it line on The Game in November. FanDuel and others had that as Michigan -4.5 before last Saturday's games. After Ohio St beat Penn State and Michigan hammered Sparty, FanDuel moved that to -7 -115 Sunday morning. Later Sunday, they lowered it to UM -6.5 -110, but that spread has stuck since late Sunday. BetRivers is currently mimicking those -6.5 -115 numbers. [Correction: currently mimicking the -6.5 -110 numbers]

Now, damning stories of this ordeal are coming out multiple times a day on this, IMO. So maybe that will move this toward a faster decision. But right now, I just don't see any key decisions being made until after mid-Jan. The NCAA almost always moves at snail's pace, and then you have the tea leaves from the oddsmakers/bettors I mentioned above.

Now, I don't know some of the key dynamics of the NC Title odds....like, what would the books do if Michigan is ruled ineligible for the CFB Playoff? Would they treat those at losses for those who bet Michigan or would they return their money? Obviously that's rather key in understanding what the odds might or might not be indicating.
Click to expand...
I don't know the answer to your questions. I would lean towards the books returning all the Michigan bets but I really don't know.
I'm not sure how liquid these GOY markets are and I wouldn't expect a huge move on the national title odds unless the hammer dropped. So I don't really read into that as much as you are.

I don't know when the NCAA will act, I agree they usually are slow. This information seems pretty well developed by this lawfirm/3rd party (I'm sure NOONE IN COLUMBUS had anything to do with it) and the level of institutional involvement that came out in the Wa Post story went pretty deep.

A few things that are different here---there's never been anything that happened like this during the legal sports gambling era. The Big Ten has gambling partners now and so anything that could impact the outcome/integrity of the games is going to be viewed much differently now IMO.
By the way, the college football playoff isn't run by the NCAA--they have nothing to do with it. The NCAA could suspend Harbaugh and the College Football Playoff committee could let him play on.
Lastly, let's say the NCAA (or Michigan) suspends Harbaugh during this season--well who coaches? The OC and DC were just as involved. So Harbaugh can't coach, but Moore and Minter can? That doesn't make any sense. So you suspend all the Michigan coaches? Then what?

It's just a total mess on a lot of levels. I don't know how this plays out or when. The only certainty to me is that Harbaugh will not be Michigan's coach come next fall. Zero chance that the NCAA takes a dive on this one.
 
Marsski said:
I don't know the answer to your questions. I would lean towards the books returning all the Michigan bets but I really don't know.
I'm not sure how liquid these GOY markets are and I wouldn't expect a huge move on the national title odds unless the hammer dropped. So I don't really read into that as much as you are.

I don't know when the NCAA will act, I agree they usually are slow. This information seems pretty well developed by this lawfirm/3rd party (I'm sure NOONE IN COLUMBUS had anything to do with it) and the level of institutional involvement that came out in the Wa Post story went pretty deep.

A few things that are different here---there's never been anything that happened like this during the legal sports gambling era. The Big Ten has gambling partners now and so anything that could impact the outcome/integrity of the games is going to be viewed much differently now IMO.
By the way, the college football playoff isn't run by the NCAA--they have nothing to do with it. The NCAA could suspend Harbaugh and the College Football Playoff committee could let him play on.
Lastly, let's say the NCAA (or Michigan) suspends Harbaugh during this season--well who coaches? The OC and DC were just as involved. So Harbaugh can't coach, but Moore and Minter can? That doesn't make any sense. So you suspend all the Michigan coaches? Then what?

It's just a total mess on a lot of levels. I don't know how this plays out or when. The only certainty to me is that Harbaugh will not be Michigan's coach come next fall. Zero chance that the NCAA takes a dive on this one.
Click to expand...
Good stuff
 
Marsski said:
I don't know the answer to your questions. I would lean towards the books returning all the Michigan bets but I really don't know.
I'm not sure how liquid these GOY markets are and I wouldn't expect a huge move on the national title odds unless the hammer dropped. So I don't really read into that as much as you are.

I don't know when the NCAA will act, I agree they usually are slow. This information seems pretty well developed by this lawfirm/3rd party (I'm sure NOONE IN COLUMBUS had anything to do with it) and the level of institutional involvement that came out in the Wa Post story went pretty deep.

A few things that are different here---there's never been anything that happened like this during the legal sports gambling era. The Big Ten has gambling partners now and so anything that could impact the outcome/integrity of the games is going to be viewed much differently now IMO.
By the way, the college football playoff isn't run by the NCAA--they have nothing to do with it. The NCAA could suspend Harbaugh and the College Football Playoff committee could let him play on.
Lastly, let's say the NCAA (or Michigan) suspends Harbaugh during this season--well who coaches? The OC and DC were just as involved. So Harbaugh can't coach, but Moore and Minter can? That doesn't make any sense. So you suspend all the Michigan coaches? Then what?

It's just a total mess on a lot of levels. I don't know how this plays out or when. The only certainty to me is that Harbaugh will not be Michigan's coach come next fall. Zero chance that the NCAA takes a dive on this one.
Click to expand...
I'd guess they let the season play out and dole out any punishments after the fact. The old meaningless "vacated wins." Have to wonder if it plays into the decision-making of the CFP committee moving forward. Maybe Michigan's margin of error just got a lot smaller?
 
Sorry for a new thread but prediction got buried in the other thread and I wanted to get your predictions in here and also have you read mine and tell me what I am missing on this ??

My prediction:

- They will be forced to vacate some or all wins from 2021 and 2022

- They will lose 5 or scholarships per season for two years

- Harbaugh will be suspended the first 3 games next season (just like he was this season for other offenses)

and that's it.

i am reading predictions of Harbaugh getting shitt-canned (I do not see this happening)

i am reading predictions of the entire staff getting shown the door (again, do not see this happening)

and also a postseason ban this season (again, do not see this)


and i am completely missing the mark on this ?

so many coaches and sports media (outside of buckeye nation) seem to think this is much ado about nothing.
 
so called "insiders" who cover B1G and tOSU are saying a punishment will likely be levied on UM by end of next week or earlier, and if not, then Purdon't will likely back out of the game in Ann Arbor set for Sat 11/04. the thought is that the other 13 schools in the B1G are so pissed off that the Petitti is backed into a corner and has to do something.

i am calling BS on it. there is no way the NCAA can conclude their investigation by next week. they take forever on things. and i don't see the B1G jumping the gun on this and trying to quickly levy a penalty against a top cash cow in the league. further, i do not see purdon't, merry-land, pun state nor the buckeyes (the next 4 michigan opponents) backing out of the scheduled games if no punishment is levied.

too much money in it for everyone to keep playing.

what are you guys hearing about a looming punishment by the B1G stepping in very soon here and dropping something on UM ?
 
majent said:
so called "insiders" who cover B1G and tOSU are saying a punishment will likely be levied on UM by end of next week or earlier, and if not, then Purdon't will likely back out of the game in Ann Arbor set for Sat 11/04. the thought is that the other 13 schools in the B1G are so pissed off that the Petitti is backed into a corner and has to do something.

i am calling BS on it. there is no way the NCAA can conclude their investigation by next week. they take forever on things. and i don't see the B1G jumping the gun on this and trying to quickly levy a penalty against a top cash cow in the league. further, i do not see purdon't, merry-land, pun state nor the buckeyes (the next 4 michigan opponents) backing out of the scheduled games if no punishment is levied.

too much money in it for everyone to keep playing.

what are you guys hearing about a looming punishment by the B1G stepping in very soon here and dropping something on UM ?
Click to expand...
This will be my first actual non-meme post in this thread, but none of this is true.

I'll continue to wait until the dust settles on all this and then I'll have a Mega post.

I'll say it again though, none of this is remotely true, at all. That is all so very laughable to begin with. I will say, with coordinated leaks, they have done exactly as they hoped to shape public perception.

As far as the NCAA stuff today... went well enough although with bye week and recruiting there was no interviews with assistants at all. Jim and upper-level people were interviewed. This is still looked at, as of now, as the head man having nothing to do with this (which was never a question to believe with if you use common sense).

A few things going forward that will be best for yourselves in gathering any somewhat credible information....

1. Don't read just headlines
2. Take 99% SM posts with a grain of salt, there is some wild stuff out there (the Tennessee-SC theory is hilarious for example).
3. Check and see who is aligned with who. I'll use Pete Thamel and the Washington Post reporter as two examples
4. The Washington Post has had so many inaccurate articles the last 5-10 years plus are a mouthpiece organization. Fwiw, I most definitely did not read that article that someone texted to me. I saw the source, so I left alone, as you all should as well.
5. Take a look at who is pushing angles, and then take a look at the reactions of most players and most coaches. You see the stark difference between these situations?

I'll chime back next week or after when we finally receive some concrete info. I'd venture that 95% so far has been incorrect and/or pure speculation. There is still a lot not known (hence my phrase of letting the dust settle). I can venture to guess to a degree what else will come out, but that is pointless. Without reading this thread, I am SURE there has been a bunch of nonsense thrown against the wall.

I will say, with regard to Michigan Football -- they need to vet their hiring of assistants and staffers MUCH better.

The Weiss stuff is NOT related, fwiw.

Also, how the heck did a certain team know what was happening -- change their signals -- and lose by 4+ TD's last year to this Michigan Team?

Also part #2. I saw some link to a TCU thing. Okay, I get it on the surface that this could make A LOT of sense. Then I want you to re-read the article and start piecing that game together and see where it makes sense. Tough, isn't it? Nothing about signals is part of pick 6's. There is nothing about signals where an official butchers a TD call. Just saying...

Also, part #3. For many years UM has been high and mighty about playing things right (not paying guys, no magic vitamins etc). A few years ago, I remember saying on here (before NIL was finalized) that I was sick of them not cheating like the SEC and OSU, So, now it happens most likely on a rogue basis. Although, this isn't cheating. This is what almost every other school does. This is nothing new. This was allowed until 1994 because the playing field wasn't level for all schools to afford travel and tickers. Every school steals signs, this is well known. OSU did it very well in the back to back years shellacking Don Brown defenses. Alabama was so good that Michigan had to change their approach to the 2019 Citrus Bowl. Hell, Al Washington and Greg Mattison brought some playbooks with them to Columbus after the 2018 season! We've been laughing that Michigan would be the ones to get 'in trouble'. Pretty funny. Steroids = cheating. This, not so much.

Also part #4. Much like satellite camps and the suggestion of the 1-time free transfer (Harbaugh's open letter), this will change the NCAA rules and also allow the proper technology like the NFL and HS use. These signs and boards are so outdated. And fwiw, I would assume you have all seen the notes from the NCAA this summer and the previous few years about what a STUPID rule this is.

Again, there is SO much more to gather here, I'll wait and chime in full when it is time. I could sit here and waste my day away correcting, debunking and also agreeing with all these posts -- but time is money, amirite?


Lastly, in the spirit of our website -- USE THIS TO YOUR ADVANTAGE -- You have access to future lines -- Bet accordingly. We will have some excellent money to be made. This most definitely has changed and strengthened positions for myself as this season winds down.
 
Last edited:
B.A.R. said:
This will be my first actual non-meme post in this thread, but none of this is true.

I'll continue to wait until the dust settles on all this and then I'll have a Mega post.

I'll say it again though, none of this is remotely true, at all. That is all so very laughable to begin with. I will say, with coordinated leaks, they have done exactly as they hoped to shape public perception.

As far as the NCAA stuff today... went well enough although with bye week and recruiting there was no interviews with assistants at all. Jim and upper-level people were interviewed. This is still looked at, as of now, as the head man having nothing to do with this (which was never a question to believe with if you use common sense).

A few things going forward that will be best for yourselves in gathering any somewhat credible information....

1. Don't read just headlines
2. Take 99% SM posts with a grain of salt, there is some wild stuff out there (the Tennessee-SC theory is hilarious for example).
3. Check and see who is aligned with who. I'll use Pete Thamel and the Washington Post reporter as two examples
4. The Washington Post has had so many inaccurate articles the last 5-10 years plus are a mouthpiece organization. Fwiw, I most definitely did not read that article that someone texted to me. I saw the source, so I left alone, as you all should as well.
5. Take a look at who is pushing angles, and then take a look at the reactions of most players and most coaches. You see the stark difference between these situations?

I'll chime back next week or after when we finally receive some concrete info. I'd venture that 95% so far has been incorrect and/or pure speculation. There is still a lot not known (hence my phrase of letting the dust settle). I can venture to guess to a degree what else will come out, but that is pointless. Without reading this thread, I am SURE there has been a bunch of nonsense thrown against the wall.

I will say, with regard to Michigan Football -- they need to vet their hiring of assistants and staffers MUCH better.

The Weiss stuff is NOT related, fwiw.

Also, how the heck did a certain team know what was happening -- change their signals -- and lose by 4+ TD's last year to this Michigan Team?

Also part #2. I saw some link to a TCU thing. Okay, I get it on the surface that this could make A LOT of sense. Then I want you to re-read the article and start piecing that game together and see where it makes sense. Tough, isn't it? Nothing about signals is part of pick 6's. There is nothing about signals where an official butchers a TD call. Just saying...

Also, part #3. For many years UM has been high and mighty about playing things right (not paying guys, no magic vitamins etc). A few years ago, I remember saying on here (before NIL was finalized) that I was sick of them not cheating like the SEC and OSU, So, now it happens most likely on a rogue basis. Although, this isn't cheating. This is what almost every other school does. This is nothing new. This was allowed until 1994 because the playing field wasn't level for all schools to afford travel and tickers. Every school steals signs, this is well known. OSU did it very well in the back to back years shellacking Don Brown defenses. Alabama was so good that Michigan had to change their approach to the 2019 Citrus Bowl. Hell, Al Washington and Greg Mattison brought some playbooks with them to Columbus after the 2018 season! We've been laughing that Michigan would be the ones to get 'in trouble'. Pretty funny. Steroids = cheating. This, not so much.

Also part #4. Much like satellite camps and the suggestion of the 1-time free transfer (Harbaugh's open letter), this will change the NCAA rules and also allow the proper technology like the NFL and HS use. These signs and boards are so outdated. And fwiw, I would assume you have all seen the notes from the NCAA this summer and the previous few years about what a STUPID rule this is.

Again, there is SO much more to gather here, I'll wait and chime in full when it is time. I could sit here and waste my day away correcting, debunking and also agreeing with all these posts -- but time is money, amirite?


Lastly, in the spirit of our website -- USE THIS TO YOUR ADVANTAGE -- You have access to future lines -- Bet accordingly. We will have some excellent money to be made. This most definitely has changed and strengthened positions for myself as this season winds down.
Click to expand...


I see reno has entered the chat.
 
B.A.R. said:
This will be my first actual non-meme post in this thread, but none of this is true.

I'll continue to wait until the dust settles on all this and then I'll have a Mega post.

I'll say it again though, none of this is remotely true, at all. That is all so very laughable to begin with. I will say, with coordinated leaks, they have done exactly as they hoped to shape public perception.

As far as the NCAA stuff today... went well enough although with bye week and recruiting there was no interviews with assistants at all. Jim and upper-level people were interviewed. This is still looked at, as of now, as the head man having nothing to do with this (which was never a question to believe with if you use common sense).

A few things going forward that will be best for yourselves in gathering any somewhat credible information....

1. Don't read just headlines
2. Take 99% SM posts with a grain of salt, there is some wild stuff out there (the Tennessee-SC theory is hilarious for example).
3. Check and see who is aligned with who. I'll use Pete Thamel and the Washington Post reporter as two examples
4. The Washington Post has had so many inaccurate articles the last 5-10 years plus are a mouthpiece organization. Fwiw, I most definitely did not read that article that someone texted to me. I saw the source, so I left alone, as you all should as well.
5. Take a look at who is pushing angles, and then take a look at the reactions of most players and most coaches. You see the stark difference between these situations?

I'll chime back next week or after when we finally receive some concrete info. I'd venture that 95% so far has been incorrect and/or pure speculation. There is still a lot not known (hence my phrase of letting the dust settle). I can venture to guess to a degree what else will come out, but that is pointless. Without reading this thread, I am SURE there has been a bunch of nonsense thrown against the wall.

I will say, with regard to Michigan Football -- they need to vet their hiring of assistants and staffers MUCH better.

The Weiss stuff is NOT related, fwiw.

Also, how the heck did a certain team know what was happening -- change their signals -- and lose by 4+ TD's last year to this Michigan Team?

Also part #2. I saw some link to a TCU thing. Okay, I get it on the surface that this could make A LOT of sense. Then I want you to re-read the article and start piecing that game together and see where it makes sense. Tough, isn't it? Nothing about signals is part of pick 6's. There is nothing about signals where an official butchers a TD call. Just saying...

Also, part #3. For many years UM has been high and mighty about playing things right (not paying guys, no magic vitamins etc). A few years ago, I remember saying on here (before NIL was finalized) that I was sick of them not cheating like the SEC and OSU, So, now it happens most likely on a rogue basis. Although, this isn't cheating. This is what almost every other school does. This is nothing new. This was allowed until 1994 because the playing field wasn't level for all schools to afford travel and tickers. Every school steals signs, this is well known. OSU did it very well in the back to back years shellacking Don Brown defenses. Alabama was so good that Michigan had to change their approach to the 2019 Citrus Bowl. Hell, Al Washington and Greg Mattison brought some playbooks with them to Columbus after the 2018 season! We've been laughing that Michigan would be the ones to get 'in trouble'. Pretty funny. Steroids = cheating. This, not so much.

Also part #4. Much like satellite camps and the suggestion of the 1-time free transfer (Harbaugh's open letter), this will change the NCAA rules and also allow the proper technology like the NFL and HS use. These signs and boards are so outdated. And fwiw, I would assume you have all seen the notes from the NCAA this summer and the previous few years about what a STUPID rule this is.

Again, there is SO much more to gather here, I'll wait and chime in full when it is time. I could sit here and waste my day away correcting, debunking and also agreeing with all these posts -- but time is money, amirite?


Lastly, in the spirit of our website -- USE THIS TO YOUR ADVANTAGE -- You have access to future lines -- Bet accordingly. We will have some excellent money to be made. This most definitely has changed and strengthened positions for myself as this season winds down.
Click to expand...
How someone cannot see that this is a coordinated effort to get the NCAA to "do something" is beyond me. Someone (in Ohio) packaged some info about Michigan and took it to the NCAA and did not like the response they received. Now those same people are heading an operation to push the worst possible version of their narrative to willing members of the media who are looking for clicks and fleeting moments of importance. Social media then amplifies this for the same reasons. We have seen this for years now and it is kinda hard not to see it.

Will something happen to Michigan? Yes it will because the purpose of this operation is to make it sound way worse than it actually is.

Will people in Ohio be disappointed? Yes, because the purpose of this operation is to make it sound way worse than it actually is.
 
He Hate Me said:
How someone cannot see that this is a coordinated effort to get the NCAA to "do something" is beyond me. Someone (in Ohio) packaged some info about Michigan and took it to the NCAA and did not like the response they received. Now those same people are heading an operation to push the worst possible version of their narrative to willing members of the media who are looking for clicks and fleeting moments of importance. Social media then amplifies this for the same reasons. We have seen this for years now and it is kinda hard not to see it.

Will something happen to Michigan? Yes it will because the purpose of this operation is to make it sound way worse than it actually is.

Will people in Ohio be disappointed? Yes, because the purpose of this operation is to make it sound way worse than it actually is.
Click to expand...
Promote baseless conspiracy theories. Deflect and shift blame toward evil parties. Take zero accountability for your own actions. Cast yourself as a victim.

Rinse. Repeat.

It's been this way forever with the mich fanbase. Whether it's the refs, Tressel, Urban, Day, James Franklin, Sparty, the dirty SEC, NCAA witch-hunt. They're all out to get us. It's always someone else's fault. We are pure and innocent. Everyone cheats but us. It's delusional cult worship.
 
Last edited:
AliShaheed said:
Promote baseless conspiracy theories. Deflect and shift blame toward evil parties. Take zero accountability for your own actions. Cast yourself as a victim.

Rinse. Repeat.

It's been this way forever with the mich fanbase. Whether it's the refs, Tressel, Urban, Day, James Franklin, Sparty, the dirty SEC, NCAA witch-hunt. They're all out to get us. It's always someone else's fault. We are pure and innocent. Everyone cheats but us. It's delusional cult worship.
Click to expand...
ok, I am not a Michigan fan or even a Big 10 (or whatever they call themselves now) fan. Every college sports fan or alumni thinks that way about their team.
 
B.A.R. said:
This will be my first actual non-meme post in this thread, but none of this is true.

I'll continue to wait until the dust settles on all this and then I'll have a Mega post.

I'll say it again though, none of this is remotely true, at all. That is all so very laughable to begin with. I will say, with coordinated leaks, they have done exactly as they hoped to shape public perception.

As far as the NCAA stuff today... went well enough although with bye week and recruiting there was no interviews with assistants at all. Jim and upper-level people were interviewed. This is still looked at, as of now, as the head man having nothing to do with this (which was never a question to believe with if you use common sense).

A few things going forward that will be best for yourselves in gathering any somewhat credible information....

1. Don't read just headlines
2. Take 99% SM posts with a grain of salt, there is some wild stuff out there (the Tennessee-SC theory is hilarious for example).
3. Check and see who is aligned with who. I'll use Pete Thamel and the Washington Post reporter as two examples
4. The Washington Post has had so many inaccurate articles the last 5-10 years plus are a mouthpiece organization. Fwiw, I most definitely did not read that article that someone texted to me. I saw the source, so I left alone, as you all should as well.
5. Take a look at who is pushing angles, and then take a look at the reactions of most players and most coaches. You see the stark difference between these situations?

I'll chime back next week or after when we finally receive some concrete info. I'd venture that 95% so far has been incorrect and/or pure speculation. There is still a lot not known (hence my phrase of letting the dust settle). I can venture to guess to a degree what else will come out, but that is pointless. Without reading this thread, I am SURE there has been a bunch of nonsense thrown against the wall.

I will say, with regard to Michigan Football -- they need to vet their hiring of assistants and staffers MUCH better.

The Weiss stuff is NOT related, fwiw.

Also, how the heck did a certain team know what was happening -- change their signals -- and lose by 4+ TD's last year to this Michigan Team?

Also part #2. I saw some link to a TCU thing. Okay, I get it on the surface that this could make A LOT of sense. Then I want you to re-read the article and start piecing that game together and see where it makes sense. Tough, isn't it? Nothing about signals is part of pick 6's. There is nothing about signals where an official butchers a TD call. Just saying...

Also, part #3. For many years UM has been high and mighty about playing things right (not paying guys, no magic vitamins etc). A few years ago, I remember saying on here (before NIL was finalized) that I was sick of them not cheating like the SEC and OSU, So, now it happens most likely on a rogue basis. Although, this isn't cheating. This is what almost every other school does. This is nothing new. This was allowed until 1994 because the playing field wasn't level for all schools to afford travel and tickers. Every school steals signs, this is well known. OSU did it very well in the back to back years shellacking Don Brown defenses. Alabama was so good that Michigan had to change their approach to the 2019 Citrus Bowl. Hell, Al Washington and Greg Mattison brought some playbooks with them to Columbus after the 2018 season! We've been laughing that Michigan would be the ones to get 'in trouble'. Pretty funny. Steroids = cheating. This, not so much.

Also part #4. Much like satellite camps and the suggestion of the 1-time free transfer (Harbaugh's open letter), this will change the NCAA rules and also allow the proper technology like the NFL and HS use. These signs and boards are so outdated. And fwiw, I would assume you have all seen the notes from the NCAA this summer and the previous few years about what a STUPID rule this is.

Again, there is SO much more to gather here, I'll wait and chime in full when it is time. I could sit here and waste my day away correcting, debunking and also agreeing with all these posts -- but time is money, amirite?


Lastly, in the spirit of our website -- USE THIS TO YOUR ADVANTAGE -- You have access to future lines -- Bet accordingly. We will have some excellent money to be made. This most definitely has changed and strengthened positions for myself as this season winds down.
Click to expand...

BAR
sorry for a very dumb question as I should know this, but are you a Michigan diehard like HUNT is?

i am asking respectfully, not trying to be a punk smart ass. i know you love CFB and are a true diehard of the game, but is Mich your favorite squad and are you a hardcore fan like HUNT is?

If so, then you cannot be 99% objective (no one can be 100% ob just like my tOSU buddies (here in CA i have 3 of them strangely enough LOL) are calling for everything but the Death Penalty here for Mich. they cannot be 99% objective either.

the extremes i am hearing on both sides means the truth must lie somewhere in the middle.

this is not Watergate but it is not a nothing-burger either, right ?

HUNT is obviously pretty worried about this. and we know he is a diehard, so when i see that it gives me pause that maybe this is pretty bad.

my tOSU diehard fanboy buddies? i am pretty much ignoring that noise right now LOL
 
majent said:
BAR
sorry for a very dumb question as I should know this, but are you a Michigan diehard like HUNT is?

i am asking respectfully, not trying to be a punk smart ass. i know you love CFB and are a true diehard of the game, but is Mich your favorite squad and are you a hardcore fan like HUNT is?

If so, then you cannot be 99% objective (no one can be 100% ob just like my tOSU buddies (here in CA i have 3 of them strangely enough LOL) are calling for everything but the Death Penalty here for Mich. they cannot be 99% objective either.

the extremes i am hearing on both sides means the truth must lie somewhere in the middle.

this is not Watergate but it is not a nothing-burger either, right ?

HUNT is obviously pretty worried about this. and we know he is a diehard, so when i see that it gives me pause that maybe this is pretty bad.

my tOSU diehard fanboy buddies? i am pretty much ignoring that noise right now LOL
Click to expand...

It’s absolutely a nothing burger. I’m not a fan of Michigan, tOSU, or anyone else really for that matter. It’s a bunch of whining that is easily remedied (see my post above with the 3 ways it can be EASILY stopped).
 
jedi ninja said:
It’s absolutely a nothing burger. I’m not a fan of Michigan, tOSU, or anyone else really for that matter. It’s a bunch of whining that is easily remedied (see my post above with the 3 ways it can be EASILY stopped).
Click to expand...
30 year rule saying schools cannot use video technology and send scouts to games for opponents in the same season, but it's a nothing burger?

i will say again that it is much more than UM nation saying and much less than Buckeye nation is saying.

the truth has to be somewhere in the middle.

it has to.

way too much smoke here but not a wildfire out of control.
 
so many coaches are laughing this off and downplaying it, could it be that they are doing the same thing as UM hence they are downplaying this ??
 
why are they "witch hunting" michigan and harbaugh?

the could do it to ryan day, kirby smart, nick saban, dabo swinney, jimbo fisher, brian kelly, etc etc etc etc

why are they witch hunting harbaugh?

maybe he has lost control of his institution?

i am just asking why they would to this to him if there was nothing to it ?
 
majent said:
why are they "witch hunting" michigan and harbaugh?

the could do it to ryan day, kirby smart, nick saban, dabo swinney, jimbo fisher, brian kelly, etc etc etc etc

why are they witch hunting harbaugh?

maybe he has lost control of his institution?

i am just asking why they would to this to him if there was nothing to it ?
Click to expand...
Harbaugh wants to revenue share with players.

The NCAA is already crumbling as is.

That's another stake in the heart.

The NCAA would love for Jim to go away.

That's not what this is entirely about, at all. But, it sure helps. Most every idea Jim has for CFB is not looked upon fondly by the NCAA

Oh, Jim Stapleton.

Also, thanks for the share. I would have proofread the 2am post. Next time, I'll do better.

Back in a few weeks.

Oh, 104-50 the last two years in games where this didn't come into play whatsoever.
 
Beat downs but the Buckeye side says it did come into play both years.

One thing for sure - before 2021 and 2022, jimmy was owned by Ohio state and that was a narrative he needed to reverse.
 
majent said:
BAR
sorry for a very dumb question as I should know this, but are you a Michigan diehard like HUNT is?

i am asking respectfully, not trying to be a punk smart ass. i know you love CFB and are a true diehard of the game, but is Mich your favorite squad and are you a hardcore fan like HUNT is?

If so, then you cannot be 99% objective (no one can be 100% ob just like my tOSU buddies (here in CA i have 3 of them strangely enough LOL) are calling for everything but the Death Penalty here for Mich. they cannot be 99% objective either.

the extremes i am hearing on both sides means the truth must lie somewhere in the middle.

this is not Watergate but it is not a nothing-burger either, right ?

HUNT is obviously pretty worried about this. and we know he is a diehard, so when i see that it gives me pause that maybe this is pretty bad.

my tOSU diehard fanboy buddies? i am pretty much ignoring that noise right now LOL
Click to expand...

HUNT is a Pessimistic cat.
 
B.A.R. said:
Harbaugh wants to revenue share with players.

The NCAA is already crumbling as is.

That's another stake in the heart.

The NCAA would love for Jim to go away.

That's not what this is entirely about, at all. But, it sure helps. Most every idea Jim has for CFB is not looked upon fondly by the NCAA

Oh, Jim Stapleton.

Also, thanks for the share. I would have proofread the 2am post. Next time, I'll do better.

Back in a few weeks.

Oh, 104-50 the last two years in games where this didn't come into play whatsoever.
Click to expand...

I love this thread.


 
I am also in the camp that Jim had to know this was going on. I just don't see how his OC's knew and he didn't?? That is murky at best. I don't believe this was a lone wolf thing. JMO.
 
HUNT said:
I am also in the camp that Jim had to know this was going on. I just don't see how his OC's knew and he didn't?? That is murky at best. I don't believe this was a lone wolf thing. JMO.
Click to expand...

Which makes me pessimistic because that would be show cause or lack of institutional control like Marski mentioned earlier.
 
majent said:
why are they "witch hunting" michigan and harbaugh?

the could do it to ryan day, kirby smart, nick saban, dabo swinney, jimbo fisher, brian kelly, etc etc etc etc

why are they witch hunting harbaugh?

maybe he has lost control of his institution?

i am just asking why they would to this to him if there was nothing to it ?
Click to expand...

This started way back in satellite camps. Harbaugh finds loopholes to shit and they hate it.
 
If jimmy did not know then it's lack of institutional control.

Breaking a 30 year rule so egregiously if it did happen, is not cool lol
 
Buck50 said:
A view from another Buckeye fan here, while trying to evalute what the NCAA might do, will do, or won't do. The one thing that is flying in the face of some of my opinions are the current odds. Michigan's Nat'l Title odds have gotten shorter, not longer. 'Some' of this I think ties into Georgia's (relative) struggles and the key Brock Bowers injury. But it's clear that oddsmakers don't feel that Michigan got much of a bump from the sign stealing.....at least in terms of this year's team. Then, you have the look-ahead/Games of the Year/whatever you want to call it line on The Game in November. FanDuel and others had that as Michigan -4.5 before last Saturday's games. After Ohio St beat Penn State and Michigan hammered Sparty, FanDuel moved that to -7 -115 Sunday morning. Later Sunday, they lowered it to UM -6.5 -110, but that spread has stuck since late Sunday. BetRivers is currently mimicking those -6.5 -115 numbers. [Correction: currently mimicking the -6.5 -110 numbers]

Now, damning stories of this ordeal are coming out multiple times a day on this, IMO. So maybe that will move this toward a faster decision. But right now, I just don't see any key decisions being made until after mid-Jan. The NCAA almost always moves at snail's pace, and then you have the tea leaves from the oddsmakers/bettors I mentioned above.

Now, I don't know some of the key dynamics of the NC Title odds....like, what would the books do if Michigan is ruled ineligible for the CFB Playoff? Would they treat those at losses for those who bet Michigan or would they return their money? Obviously that's rather key in understanding what the odds might or might not be indicating.
Click to expand...
Those would be losses. They HAVE to be losses because the presence of Michigan in the field affected the odds for all the other contenders. The + money for all the bets on other teams would have been lower if there had been no chance of Michigan winning.
 
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