My take on the BIG-12 title tie-break situation

M

majent

Oklahoma Sooners
2 disclaimers before I begin. 1) I am on OU fan and have been since 1986, so it's clear where my loyalties lie. 2) Each team still as 1 game left on their respective schedules so this is all assuming Texas beats Texas A&M, Texas Tech beats Baylor, and OU beats OSU. If all 3 wins occur by the 3 respective teams, here's how I believe it should and will play out.

1) OU will have lost to Texas by 10 on a neutral but beaten Tex Tech by 44 in Norman and will have beaten OSU in Stoolwater (I choose OSU because they're the next best team under these 3 in the BIG-12 South and all 3 teams had to play them). In OOC play, they will have beaten the BIG EAST champion (Cincinnati), and the 2nd place MWC team (TCU).

2) Texas Tech will have beaten Texas by 6 pts in Lubbock, OSU by 36 in Lubbock, and will have lost to OU by 44 in Norman. In OOC play, they have a decent win over Nevada who is currently in a 3-way tie for 3rd in the WAC). They have no other impressive OOC wins.

3) Texas will have beaten OU by 10 on a neutral, OSU by 4 in Austin, and lost by 6 to Tex Tech at Lubbock. Their OOC play consists of Florida Atlantic, UTEP, Arkansas, and Rice. Arkansas had their worst team and worst season in years. Not Texas's fault, but it is what it is.

If OU jumps Texas in the BCS Standings and wins the BIG-12 South tiebreaker, which most people believe will happen, Texas fans will scream that they beat OU by 10 pts so they (the Longhorns) deserve the BIG-12 title tie-breaker.

I say the Texas claim is nonsense. They should not go to the BIG-12 title game ahead of Texas Tech if both are 11-1, so stop worrying about where OU is going. Tex Tech beat YOU, and WE SMASHED Tex Tech.

If all 3 teams finish 11-1 as my argument presumes, why should Texas go ahead in the tie-breaker over Texas Tech? Did they not lose to Tex Tech?

If OU does not deserve to go ahead of Texas, then Texas does not deserve to go ahead of Texas Tech. It's as simple as that.

Moreover, OU played BY FAR the most impressive OOC schedule of the 3, and the 44 pt win over Texas Tech will be the most impressive victory that any of them had over each other, plus, OU's presumed win over OSU, even if by just 1 pt, will be more impressive than Texas's 4 pt win in Austin over OSU.

In a 3-way tie like this, it pretty much turns into a beauty contest, and after tonight's demolition of the Red Raiders in Norman, OU heads to Stoolwater as BY FAR the "best-looking, most well-spoken team" in this beauty pagaent.

If the Sooners beat OSU, even by a low score, I have quite a bit of faith that the voters in the ESPN/USA Today and Harris Polls, respectively, will see things the same way I do and rank OU above both Texas and Tex Tech.

Then it will be on to KC to play Missouri, and the Sooners get by them, I believe the BCS Title Game in Miami will await them................

My .02

:36_7_1:
 
Last edited:
^^^Crap.

Just kidding, Majent. I'm not going to get into this. It's just a pissing match. In the three-way tie, everyone has a scoreboard argument over 1 team--hence the BCS tie-breaker.

Simple solution: Take the top 2 BCS teams in the South (OU and Texas) and play a tie-breaker.

All of this should be settled on the field and simply shows the significant problems with college football and seating teams for a MNC game.
 
Why even write all that after your first paragraph. What a surprise, you picked OU. Just like I would say Scoreboard, Texas goes to the Big 12 Championship.
 
RJ Esq;It's just a pissing match. In the three-way tie, everyone has a scoreboard argument over 1 team--hence the BCS tie-breaker.

Exactly. :shake:

Simple solution: Take the top 2 BCS teams in the South (OU and Texas) and play a tie-breaker.

WOULD LOVE to see OU and Texas play again. OU is a much better team today than they were that day, and even though MLB Ryan R. would not play, I would like the Sooners chances in a rematch because Shipley would not get another kickoff return for TD against the improved OU ST's and Sam would likely not throw 2 picks again.

:shake:
 
albyman32 said:
Why even write all that after your first paragraph. What a surprise, you picked OU. Just like I would say Scoreboard, Texas goes to the Big 12 Championship.
Click to expand...

I laid out all the facts, which have nothing to do with my team allegiance. I only mentioned my allegiance to OU to explain that I cannot be 100% objective when I gave my opinion on who should go to the BIG-12 title game which I gave below the facts.

I believe the facts speak for themselves. Most of the CFB pundits are already saying OU should be ranked higher than Texas and I have a strong hunch the voters will follow. If not tomorrow, then next Sunday after OU (hopefully) beats Okie St.
 
I disagree that you laid out all the facts. You recited the party stance that Stoops unveiled postgame, but that stance equates the TTU win over UT to the UT win over OU.

Why are we equating them?

UT beat OU on a neutral field. UT lost to TTU on the road (on a last-second play). You're not really laying out all the facts unless you point that out.
 
I wouldn't presume that any of the South division teams will get by Missouri who is laying in wait, very quietly, enjoying the fact that people have forgotten them...
 
I don't get this.

They already played.

OU has improved since that time as has Texas.

How can someone say "yea, OU lost straight up but if you look at the common opponent". You could make an argument every team is better than every other team using that argument.

Couple things to consider

AT home at night on the primetime national ABC spot makes the home team play like superman in the Big XII this year. @ Tech vs. @ Oklahoma.

Texas had just played Oklahoma, Missouri, Oklahoma State. Yeah, that is a grind and a half without a break and then to play TT.

The bye week for Oklahoma helped them tremendously to face the TT offfense, Texas did not have one. TT doesn't need a bye because their offense is like Bob Knights motion it's the same constant plays.

---matchups enable common opponents to distort things.

Stoops has OWNED Leach's offense like this for years, except for last year, which coincidently was ABC primetime home game for Tech.

OU/Stoops is sooo good at aggressively pinching own on dump passes, i.e. the plays 95% of colleges allow as "free" yards. Even a 5 yard sideline out. Screens, draws, Oklahoma is the best in the country and has been the best in the country at stopping that.

That is like taking away Michigan State's running game for Tech. Because TT is built upon the flare out's, the dump's to the rb's, the screen's, it all sets up everything else.

Oklahoma is vulnerable in the middle of the field down the field.

Against more traditional offenses Oklahoma will struggle, say like Texas?

Texas completely and utterly dominated the lines and wore Oklahoma out. There was no "down to the wire" close game where it could of gone either way.

Texas was superior. There was no doubt.

TT as a measuring stick between the two teams is laughable.
 
The facts have been the same for weeks now, the only difference between the 3 teams is that OU had not had their day yet to play TexTech and Okie State. Now 1 is down with 1 to go. The only other dominating win amongst the Fearsome Foursome (OU, TX, TX TECH, OSU) was TexTech's drubbing of OSU 2 weeks ago by 36 pts. OU's win tonight over TexTech trumped that one out, especially because it occurred over a 10-0 team ranked #2 in the BCS. If you are ranked #2 in the BCS in late November, you are quite a team. OU is now "quite a team" and then some.

If OU beats OSU, I'll be very surprised if they do not earn the BIG-12 Title Game berth.

If OU then beats Missouri, I'll be very surprised if they do not earn the BCS Title Game berth.

From where I stand, OU controls their own destiny.

Let's see what the BCS thinks about that the next 3 Sundays. I have a hunch I'm on the same page that they are.
 
you can make a case for why each team should go, saying texas lost to tech, and ou beat tech means they should go is flat out retarded. texas beat ou by dd on a neutral field. you can't say ou is better now and shipley wouldn't return the kick, bradford no 3 int's, etc., bc the game took place and OU lost. you could make similar argument for ut then...

if crabtree doesn't score on a last second td then ut would still be undefeated and playing in big 12 title game, so they should go. (this is a joke, obviously)

the bcs isn't equipped to handle situations like this which is why a playoff is needed.

ut beat ou by dd on a neutral field...not sure how you overlook that.
 
alot of good opinions, but here are some more details.

--if crabtree hadn't scored that last second touchdown for tt over tex, they still would have lined up for a chip-shot field goal to WIN the game (w/ a walk-on who won a kicking contest because he can consistantly hit the extra-point range field goal.


2ndly as a big 12 outsider, in a 3 way tie like this, I automatically look to non-conference and see that okla beat a very good cincy team and a very good tcu team and beat them both comfortably. frankly, i feal that texas should be embarressed by their non-con schedule this year-- fla atl, utep & rice are you kidding me!!!

if you want to beat the little texas step-children at least sched hou or tcu, or go grab tulsa out of okla. just as tex non-con. sched. propelled them to the championship game w/ vince when they beat ohio st., i feel it should now keep them home to prove a point that the "soft, safe schedule" is not the path to the championship in today's ncaa.

teams aren't undefeated in these big conference and wel won't have anything to watch in august and september if we reward "bullyism" in scheduling.

ps -- i can't believe that even sooner fans are now brainwashed into thinking they play texas in a neutal field. they travel into the state of texas every year during the freaking texas state fair and play in what, dallas? how is that neutral -- those 2 phantom late hit calls on mccoy were total horseshit, home-field call and affected that game greatly. texas fans say that they handled okla w/ a ten point win but that is not as accurate as okla blew a lead and let the game get away from them. tex had a big run at the end of the game to make the margin go from 3 to 10 and the demarco murray that played tex was a shadow of the murray that just performed surgery on tt defense.

lastly, the other key factor about the blow-out last night is that, if you take the top 4 teams in the b12S (tt, tex, okla, okla st.) you see that 1/2 are from texas and 1/2 are from okla, yet last nights game was the first of game played in the state of okla after 5 previous were played in texas!! what's next okla, okie st game will being played in corpus-fucking cristi.

playoff? how about an okla-tex playoff in stillwater or tulsa?? (we don't even have to sched. it for the oklahome state fair!
 
and, if tt loses to baylor and only 2, not 3 teams are tied for the b12S, i would then say texas definetly deserves to go due to head-to-head. you have to thow the "head-to-head" argument out in a 3-way flat-footed tie. it's just so sad that the big 12 north is only as good as the wac or mac west conference, that is really why we have this mess and it's pointless to have a confenece championship game where the best team in the conference plays against the 5th best team, wtf does that prove?
 
Simple solution: Take the top 2 BCS teams in the South (OU and Texas) and play a tie-breaker.
Click to expand...

That happened... Texas won... Texas beat OU on a neutral site... Texas beat OK St... Texas lost in Lubbock in the last minute of the game... Texas should represent the B12 South in conference champ game.

Whoever prevails will have short-lived joy as Florida is going to spank some ass in the NC game... and if Florida gets upset in SEC champ game, then Saban is going to spank some ass... No getting around it, SEC takes home 3rd natl title in 3 years!
 
A question for all the Texas boys. If Okie somehow loses to Okie Lite, should Texas Tech jump Texas in the Polls? Based on all the logic that I've read here, it's a NO BRAINER Head to Head counts Can't overlook it. Texas has to drop behind TT
 
golferjoe said:
A question for all the Texas boys. If Okie somehow loses to Okie Lite, should Texas Tech jump Texas in the Polls? Based on all the logic that I've read here, it's a NO BRAINER Head to Head counts Can't overlook it. Texas has to drop behind TT
Click to expand...

Actually, at that point, it would be a two-way tie. The tiebreaker would be head-to-head record, so the polls would be irrelevant.
 
The one thing on laying out all the schedules, you OU backers conveniently don't mention the fact that Rice is 8-3 and tied for first in their division in CUSA. Also UTEP and FAU are one game from being bowl eligible. Not an overwhelming schedule, but not the dogs that most teams out there are playing.
 
All 3 of these teams are so overrated its not even funny

wow youre all good because you beat each other??

gimme a break...none of em deserve a title shot

Florida, USC or Penn State would destroy any of them
 
The same USC team who lost to Oregon State?
The same Penn State team who lost to Iowa?

If anything, Florida/OU/Texas/Texas Tech have an argument.

Oregon State and Penn State? No.
 
Both of them have a better case than someone who got embarrassed by 50 points on national tv

texas tech shouldnt even be in the top 10
 
From an outside point of view I believe that this argument is all a bunch of bunk. Each team beat the other. Each team is likely a top 5 team in America. For you to throw Texas Tech out just because of last night is insane.

You heard it here first - Oklahoma loses next week in Stillwater to make the whole thing moot.
 
yeah, i think OK state wins that game too

now i just need a&m or Baylor to shock the world and Missouri to win the Big 12 title...
 
majent said:
The facts have been the same for weeks now, the only difference between the 3 teams is that OU had not had their day yet to play TexTech and Okie State. Now 1 is down with 1 to go. The only other dominating win amongst the Fearsome Foursome (OU, TX, TX TECH, OSU) was TexTech's drubbing of OSU 2 weeks ago by 36 pts. OU's win tonight over TexTech trumped that one out, especially because it occurred over a 10-0 team ranked #2 in the BCS. If you are ranked #2 in the BCS in late November, you are quite a team. OU is now "quite a team" and then some.

If OU beats OSU, I'll be very surprised if they do not earn the BIG-12 Title Game berth.

If OU then beats Missouri, I'll be very surprised if they do not earn the BCS Title Game berth.

From where I stand, OU controls their own destiny.

Let's see what the BCS thinks about that the next 3 Sundays. I have a hunch I'm on the same page that they are.
Click to expand...

ou has looked dominant before and after the Texas game. They just couldn't beat Texas. Lucky for ou, that game wasn't for 5 quarters. Texas was getting stronger, ou was getting weaker.


Why even play the game in October if we're going to have this argument. Texas won. Scoreboard.
 
Not being a true fan of any of these teams.

Oklahoma should goto the championship game.

If they can beat Ok St by more than 1 score... Texas couldn't do it at home!

The RRS was a messy game and either team could have won, some questionable calls and some big plays all went to Texas.

After last night though, with Okla's offense in full health it's not even close.

Send the best. OU is by far the best.
 
cortez the killer said:
i feal that texas should be embarressed by their non-con schedule this year-- fla atl, utep & rice are you kidding me!!!

if you want to beat the little texas step-children at least sched hou or tcu, or go grab tulsa out of okla. ncaa.

.

ps -- i can't believe that even sooner fans are now brainwashed into thinking they play texas in a neutal field. they travel into the state of texas every year during the freaking texas state fair and play in what, dallas? how is that neutral --


playoff? how about an okla-tex playoff in stillwater or tulsa?? (we don't even have to sched. it for the oklahome state fair!
Click to expand...


Yeah, we actually scheduled tcu last year. Beat them handily with one of our worse teams. We've beaten Houston too, but we will never schedule them again.

Not proud of our OOC scheduling, but who knew Arky would be this bad.


And your neutral argument is the lamest ever. If Texas were to play Alabama in Alabama, but the stadium was 80% Texas fans, who would have an advantage? It doesn't matter what state it's played in, both teams have to travel 3 hours and the crowd is split 50/50.
 
CollegeKingRex said:
You heard it here first - Oklahoma loses next week in Stillwater to make the whole thing moot.
Click to expand...

Okie State will be formidable no doubt, but somehow I don't see you putting serious jack on them on the ML. It will be a tough game, but I have a strong hunch OU will take them. TexTech softened them up 2 wks ago.
 
chitwood said:
The one thing on laying out all the schedules, you OU backers conveniently don't mention the fact that Rice is 8-3 and tied for first in their division in CUSA. Also UTEP and FAU are one game from being bowl eligible. Not an overwhelming schedule, but not the dogs that most teams out there are playing.
Click to expand...

OU beat TCU and Cincinnati, and TCU/Cincinnati > Rice, or anyone else on Texas and Tex Tech's non-conf sched.

OU played and beat better non-conf teams BY FAR than Texas and Tex Tech.

Not even a discussion.
 
E.T.G. said:
just fighting for runner up to UF anyway
Click to expand...

If Ole Miss could beat Florida at home, OU can beat them on a neutral.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know the Gators have been a "different team" since that loss, but the SEC as a whole is down so that has made Florida look a bit better than they actually are, IMO.

Let's see how you look in Tallahassee and in Atlanta before we start crowning you.

:shake:
 
majent said:
Texas is now ahead of Texas Tech in both AP & USA Today polls now, even though they have identical 10-1 records and Tex Tech beat Texas!

DOUBLE PUKE
Click to expand...


The difference is the relatively comparable schedules of ou and texas where as texas tech has had it easy. Also the tech win over texas was at home , the ou win over tech wa at home and the texas win over ou was on a neutral.
 
Adding to the intrigue is that Texas coach Mack Brown has a vote in the coaches poll but OU coach Bob Stoops does not. The coaches do not have to reveal their ballots until the final regular-season poll, meaning that whatever Brown puts on his ballot will affect the tiebreaker - and it will stay a secret as well.

From the BCS Guru
 
vegaskyle said:
The difference is the relatively comparable schedules of ou and texas where as texas tech has had it easy. Also the tech win over texas was at home , the ou win over tech wa at home and the texas win over ou was on a neutral.
Click to expand...

Exactly. And Texas and OU are separated by 4 points in the AP and about 35 in the Coaches. Very close.

Computers loved Texas quite abit more last week, we'll see if they keep Texas ahead after the beatdown last night.
 
JPicks said:
Adding to the intrigue is that Texas coach Mack Brown has a vote in the coaches poll but OU coach Bob Stoops does not. The coaches do not have to reveal their ballots until the final regular-season poll, meaning that whatever Brown puts on his ballot will affect the tiebreaker - and it will stay a secret as well.

From the BCS Guru
Click to expand...

Mack wouldn't vote Texas #1 and OU #25 but I'm sure he would put Texas 1 or may 2 slots higher than OU somewhere between 2-4.

Man is gracious and humble but not suicidal.
 
JPicks said:
Adding to the intrigue is that Texas coach Mack Brown has a vote in the coaches poll but OU coach Bob Stoops does not. The coaches do not have to reveal their ballots until the final regular-season poll, meaning that whatever Brown puts on his ballot will affect the tiebreaker - and it will stay a secret as well.

From the BCS Guru
Click to expand...

Stoops got his vote taken away because he voted OU #1 last year and put LSU #6 to try to get his team in the title game.

OU getting 4 first place votes in the coaches poll is a freakin joke.

Let me guess who did that...

Mangino
Leach
Sumlin
Mike Stoops
 
SHSUHorn said:
Stoops got his vote taken away because he voted OU #1 last year and put LSU #6 to try to get his team in the title game.

OU getting 4 first place votes in the coaches poll is a freakin joke.

Let me guess who did that...

Mangino
Leach
Sumlin
Mike Stoops
Click to expand...

Yeah, I didn't even think about who those 4 could be--and because they are secret until the end of the year we won't know for a couple of weeks. But that makes sense.
 
I can't wait to see how these coaches voted:

Steve Spurrier
Todd Dodge
Gene Chizik
Bo Pelini
Mike Leach
Mack Brown
Bobby Bowden
Jeff Tedford
Dick Tomey
 
Harris poll is out and OU has a small lead on Texas. Texas will be #2 in the BCS but if OU beats OSU next week they will close the ground on the computers.

This is going to be a dogfight.
 
This is going to be a dogfight.

LOL, yes a real dogfight, with little binary 1's and 0's (computer talk) battling each other for the right to proclaim who participates in the MNC. I'm on the 0's for a unit.
 
Alright, Horn fans.. I'm confused. Yall need OSU to keep it close vs OU and a blow out win vs. Aggy to gain points in the BCS? Is there a way for UT to still make it to the Big 12 championship game? If OU and UT wins, does OU represent the South?

I'm confused because on our Rivals site, they are still pouring the kool-aid saying that if OSU beats OU and Tech beats Baylor, Tech represents the South in the Big 12 championship game.

?????????
 
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