What am I missing in Michigan-Wisconsin game

I haven't heard one word about Warriner/Gattis/Harbaugh stuff. In fact, I've never heard a bad thing about Ed here...only at OSU. Now, I totally understand what you are saying about the playcalling last game. It's the million dollar question going forward
 
I said before the year that DMC would play more snaps this year than Shea. I still think it is possible. If he's hurt, let the future captain go out there and get some time in.
 
EL CAPO said:
the hardest thing is to determine if wisconsin is better than they were last year after playing two of the worst run defenses in college football. While Michigan is breaking in new lbs and dl wisconsins is breaking in 4 new OL !
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Technically it's four new guys, but almost all of them played last year...

madison.com

Get ready for Badgers season with a position-by-position breakdown of Wisconsin's roster

As the Badgers get ready to kick off the 2019 season on Friday against the South Florida Bulls, Jason Galloway examines Wisconsin's roster by position for the Wisconsin State Journal.
madison.com madison.com

Center Tyler Biadasz is technically the only returning starter, though Cole Van Lanen played plenty of snaps while splitting time with Jon Dietzen at left tackle. The offensive line lost three NFL-level talents in guards Michael Deiter and Beau Benzschawel and right tackle David Edwards — something that wouldn’t be easy for any program to replace. Jason Erdmann is quite experienced now, however, and Logan Bruss started the final three games last year with Edwards out. Kayden Lyles could still push Josh Seltzner for the starting right guard spot. The group is certainly deeper than one would expect when replacing four starters, as David Moorman and Tyler Beach also appear ready to step in if needed.​
​
 
I read on one of the boards that there was some issues between jh gattis and Warriner. I don’t have inside info. Just message board scuttlebutt is all I have.

Really shouldn’t surprise anyone if true though. Jh is an A+ personality. I’m sure gattis is too, but he’s also trying to implement his scheme, then Ed has been known to cause problems everywhere he’s been. So again, if true, not surprising. Make no mistake, Ed is pissed he got passed over. He won’t be at mich much longer. Guy is a dbag. Minny ran him off even. Wouldn’t surprise me if he interviews for msu is dantonio leaves this year which I think is a possibility. But fickle may get that spot.

I won’t argue if shea is hurt, was hurt, got hurt, whenever. Fact is he’s not very good. And I think that’s proven over the years. He left miss because he lost the job to ta’Amu (sp?). Greg McElroy even sayed last week on the first team that when he saw Shea at miss that he was surprised that he was a 5* cant miss type of guy. Shea didn’t do much for him.

Imo let DMC go. Shea isn’t winning anything for you guys. Will dmc? I don’t think so. But let him have an at bat. Shea is Joey Votto. Blasts away in 8th inning when the reds are losing 8-1. But sucks when it’s time to win 2-1 vs the top teams.

Good conversation. I don’t bet across the board much. Just a few schools I follow closely. I’m short on time to dig into new mex st and even Baylor type of schools. I stay local with the b10 and a few others like Miami usc and unc. Couple others.

Please don’t take my posts as hineygate or stadium & main trash talk. Just looking to chat with u guys that are a bit more knowledgeable.
 
It's all good. I'll repeat that this spring/summer it's been stated universally that this is the best chemistry on a JH staff yet. The last bad apple was Mattison. He had to go. Ed would be interesting at MSU. Dantonio is retiring most likely even from Sparty sources. He has 3 offensive recruits so far and the cupboard is bare. The Curtis Blackwell issue has pretty much made it impossible for him to recruit in metro Detroit at all. He's screwed as is. I think the pecking order for MSU is 1. Fickell 2. Mike Tressell 3. Narduzzi then maybe a surprise.
 
DMC will start the next two years. He's awesome and the players love him. I'm not down on Shea... I'd it the injury? Why did he look so good in camp? Who knows.
 
Tressel? Nard-dog? Gtfo. If msu makes that hire then they deserve to play in the tampon bowl every year through 2057. I’m not saying your thinking is wrong, I’m saying MSU’s thinking would be wrong to consider those two. But I agree nard will be considered because dantonio will give him a reference.

They need to hand Matt Campbell a blank check and tell him to fill it in. Msu is obviously a better job than isu but I don’t think Campbell would fill the check in. I think he’s waiting for ND osu mich psu type of job.

I think msu has fickells name all over it. And I think he’d do very well. One thing that has hurt dantonio, along with harbaugh securing a lot of the mich talent, is UK taking the 2nd tier ohio kids. MSU owned that demographic during their run. Not anymore and I think fickell would change that dynamic.

I can say from a rival perspective, osu fans hope mccafrey stays around. I/we just don’t think he’s the type that will lead you to the promise land. Compare him to some of our greats: henne Troy denard JT Haskins and now Fields. I can’t see him coming close to any of those names.

Imo the qb position has killed harbaugh at mich. His best qb has been an Iowa transfer. And until that gets figured out I don’t see conf titles. My #hottake is harbaugh leaves mich before winning a BIG title. In fact, I think this could be his last year as I think I said in an earlier post.
 
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But this is a huge game for mich.

If they lose the wheels could come off, especially if they lose bad. Which I don’t think they will lose bad.

But a loss keeps the negative train rolling. IMO this is a must win game and the pressure is huge.

They win, they could be looking at a 11-1/10-2 season. They lose they could be looking at a 9-3/8-4 season.
 
mutosufan said:
But this is a huge game for mich.

If they lose the wheels could come off, especially if they lose bad. Which I don’t think they will lose bad.

But a loss keeps the negative train rolling. IMO this is a must win game and the pressure is huge.

They win, they could be looking at a 11-1/10-2 season. They lose they could be looking at a 9-3/8-4 season.
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I expected them to lose this game before the season started. A crossover game isn't a huge deal. With this schedule, 9-3 regular season is solid IMO.
 
mutosufan said:
Tressel? Nard-dog? Gtfo. If msu makes that hire then they deserve to play in the tampon bowl every year through 2057. I’m not saying your thinking is wrong, I’m saying MSU’s thinking would be wrong to consider those two. But I agree nard will be considered because dantonio will give him a reference.

They need to hand Matt Campbell a blank check and tell him to fill it in. Msu is obviously a better job than isu but I don’t think Campbell would fill the check in. I think he’s waiting for ND osu mich psu type of job.

I think msu has fickells name all over it. And I think he’d do very well. One thing that has hurt dantonio, along with harbaugh securing a lot of the mich talent, is UK taking the 2nd tier ohio kids. MSU owned that demographic during their run. Not anymore and I think fickell would change that dynamic.

I can say from a rival perspective, osu fans hope mccafrey stays around. I/we just don’t think he’s the type that will lead you to the promise land. Compare him to some of our greats: henne Troy denard JT Haskins and now Fields. I can’t see him coming close to any of those names.

Imo the qb position has killed harbaugh at mich. His best qb has been an Iowa transfer. And until that gets figured out I don’t see conf titles. My #hottake is harbaugh leaves mich before winning a BIG title. In fact, I think this could be his last year as I think I said in an earlier post.
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The thing is, the QB room was empty when he got here. That showed in 2017. He has recruited well. I believe you all are wrong on DMC but we'll see over the next few years. I expect Milton to leave this year but with Cade around plus Free Agency they'll be fine. JJ getting here is when things start to get real exciting. That's easily the best recruit at the position since Drew Henson and George isn't Alive to buy him away ;)
 
Everyone said it would take 5 years for Jim to rebuild this program. Then narratives changed very quickly. This is year 5. I'm not expecting anything crazy this year but a solid season where they improve as it goes. He's not going anywhere... His family is firmly entrenched in A2 right now. He's a polorizing figure for the national media and it cracks me up.
 
VirginiaCavs said:
Yea this same sorta recency bias informed Spartan backers this weekend. ASU had just barely beat an fcs squad. MSU rocked Western Mich with its stellar offense. Whoops
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Hey, in defense to me I didn’t know who either of them had played (that how I cap! Lol) I just thought sparty was better and surely would want some revenge from last season.. don’t be trying to figure out why i bet the things i do!!! Lmao
 
As far as the Sparty next coach. Their fanbase seems to think Matt Campbell would jump at that. We both know better than that. He had eyes on bigger stakes. I'm simply stating what most MSU people think will happen. I do think fickell as well...all part of him starting to snipe at Jim about the transfer (notice every transfer got cleared from last year). Hudson was upset he didn't get to start a game last year, nothing more and nothing less. It was widely known as it happened.
 
mutosufan said:
I’m on wisky -3. Prob take wisky up to 4 maybe 5 but losing value there.

I know more in depth about mich than I do wisky tbh.

Mich O:

I put my preseason thoughts down earlier on here and they seem to be close.

QB:

Patterson is just ok. But he’s played below that thus far. He hasn’t played well. There was an interview of gattis I read right before the season started where he said he thought shea would blow his phone up once he got to AA but it never happened. He was working out with the WRs. Is this why Shea looks lost? I never thought he was particularly good, just ok, but this could be an extenuating circumstance as to why he looks so bad in a 3rd offense in 4 years. Ave arm. Above ave legs that aren’t used. And terrible decision making through 2 games. IMO he’s thinking too much. Rumor is he’s playing through an injury. Regardless, hes not been good.

RB:

This group is atrocious and it shouldn’t be like this at mich. A true frosh coming off knee surgery in the spring is carrying it 33 times for 3 ypc vs army? Really? That’s a beating he’s taking. And shouldn’t happen. If I were osu msu psu id hammer that into recruits mom and dads head. But They have no one else at rb and this is a problem going forward. Charbonnet is said to be the best blocker of the group, but they need more out of a rb than 3 ypc and a good blocker tbh.

OL:

Vastly overrated in the preseason. Runyon has been dinged and now, there’s a rumor that their 2nd string RT is out. Now down to their 3rd string RT. Ouch. Even if Runyon comes back this week do we expect he’s up to game speed? I’m doubting it. 3rd string RT. RG owenu who is average. Wiskys DL isn’t Clemson ‘18 but they should be able to win more than they lose here.

WR:

Thanks Shea. Yeah, they’ve had some drops here and there, but this is all on Shea. He’s missing wrs. He’s missing reads. DPJ should return but how does that help Shea? This group can win but obviously needs the qb. I’m just not sure these 2 units work well together. I never thought this group has lived up to their hs rankings but then again, it could be because of their qb.

Mich D:

Basically leave this short. Their DL isn’t very good compared to years past. It’s just ok. However, there are no backups to help out. And imo the starters here are backups at osu bama Clemson ga and psu even. There’s no winovich. No bush. And as lackluster Gary was, there’s no Gary. They moved a fullback over to help out. That speaks a lot.

I don’t want to hear how this mich D held army to their lowest rushing total since the jimmy carter administration. This wisky OL is by far a different animal. This rushing attack is a different animal. Playing an academy is all about discipline. No one has ever said harbaugh teams are undisciplined (other than a little this year so far). So I’m not surprised mich was gap sound vs army and showed a solid D.

Mich dbs wont win or lose this game. This game comes down to the front 7.

My call:

Rumors are already swirling that harbaugh, gattis, and, yes, The Ed, are not seeing eye-to-eye. Last weeks game had harbaughs fingerprints all over it. Post all the YouTube vids you want of harbaugh not talking on the headset during the last drive. The last 3 drives that consisted of 19 rush attempts vs army was his design and his game plan. He’s not giving up the keys totally. He’s Not fully invested in the new scheme. But he needs to be to take the next step.

Mich has made a ton of mistakes through 2 games and their faithful think it can be corrected with a bye week. As an osu fan, we said the same thing the last 2 years about our penalties and special teams with a top 3 all time coach running the show. The corner never came and osu remained stinking it up. I don’t see mich correcting this over a week of berating by the staff.

I think the wisky OL is going to push the mich DL around for 3 quarters but mich will hang for a bit. Wisky will then take over in the mid 3rd/4th to cover.

The mich rushing attack will be blah.

Shea will be blah. To the point he may share snaps with Mccafrey in the 2nd half.

And harbaughs road stats speak for themselves.

I’m laying the -3.5.
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Couldn't have said it better myself.
 
Harbaugh needs to let Gattis run the show to win Saturday...and Caff at qb.

I agree with most of mutosu says except the mccafferey thing...dude has the genes and can run the rpo great...and can flat run.
 
Should be a a good one.....hopefully.

Michigan has a good kicker at least.

Excited for the game.

GL on your bets.
 
cubsker said:
If they suck for a half, I wouldn't be surprised if they switch at halftime.
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This and @HUNT ‘spost above are right along my line of thought. Do you trust Jack Coan against a solid defense? Michigan’s wounds have mainly been self inflicted...if they don’t turn the football over and win the battle along the lines of scrimmage (which I think they can), they are dead even at WORST with Wisconsin.

I do think Shea is on a short leash and think Cub nailed it in that even stubborn-as-shit JH knows this new offense with Shea isn’t clicking...this is a conference game where the stake is much higher...think we definitely see the kid getting more time and sometimes that’s what an offense needs...a kick in the ass wake up call.

This game was Michigan -6.5/7 two weeks ago...if you’re telling me Michigan is now 10.5 points worse in the pointspread in the last 14 days I call bullshit.

Did we already forget that an OU team last year that made the playoff also needed OT to bear Army? Has Michigan looked like ass so far, yes. Has Wisconsin looked amazing so far, yes.

If Wisky looks half as good as they have in the first two games and Michigan keeps turning the football over and loses the TO battle, Badgers will win.

But giving me more than a FG in an expected low scoring game with the better coach and a bye week to prepare? I’m all over that. And if Michigan dare I say wins the TO battle...they win by 7-10.
 
All I've seen from Wisky was the game vs USF. Did Coan fare any better in hitting wide open receivers against CMU?
 
Has Michigan ever struggled vs pro styled offenses under JH? Defensively that is. I suspect they’ll be able to compete and limit Wisky’s run attack.
 
People are reading too much into the Army result. The last team to beat Army in OT had such a bad season they only lost to Alabama in a playofff game.

On what they have shown, Michigan simply have no offense. Wisconsin a FG fave at home against the 3rd or 4th best team in the east?
 
cubsker said:
Michigan has the more talented team, so it's tough to give the more talented team a bunch of pts. Wisconsin surely deserves to be favored from what we've seen thus far. Mich needs to open it up and get the ball to the perimeter where they have speed advantages. Will they? Who knows.
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Agreed on talent the lack of discipline ie. coaching is a major concern and it can trump talent.... And we arent talking bama/osu talent... But Sure they are slightly more talented. Lets not forget that this team is being held back by 2 straight average recruiting classes where jimmy went out and straight stole players that were destined for toledo and western michigan. 2019 was a top 10 class but they are only true freshmen with Dax getting a ton of burn deservedly so.. But there is not a player on michigans D that would crack the starting lineup at bama clemson or osu and in my mind those are the only teams that can line up and in conference play and out talent another team. Esp a team like wisky in their own back yard.
 
Alan Tongue said:
People are reading too much into the Army result. The last team to beat Army in OT had such a bad season they only lost to Alabama in a playofff game.

On what they have shown, Michigan simply have no offense. Wisconsin a FG fave at home against the 3rd or 4th best team in the east?
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I have yet to watch the Army game. I plan to tomorrow morning finally. I just went through every play individually though beforehand. I came up with some different thoughts than what I had heard previously.
 
B.A.R. said:
I have yet to watch the Army game. I plan to tomorrow morning finally. I just went through every play individually though beforehand. I came up with some different thoughts than what I had heard previously.
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There are a couple plays in the game that would totally change the perception. I distractedly watch 8-10 games simultaneously so that leaves me seeing a little of alot but not alot of specifics, but what I remember seeing was Mich O that didn't look comfortable or confident and an OL that appeared lost on what they were supposed to do. And the playcalling was very questionable and overly conservative, running Charbonnet 33x up the middle? I might think that maybe, just maybe, Michigan was and is holding a whole lot back for this game and the Big Ten schedule to not put it out there on tape. I would think that, but they just didn't look good executing what they were calling so I can't imagine them running the hidden surprise stuff good either.

The bye week helps Michigan a ton.

If this game was week 3 with Wisconsin hotter than hell and Michigan stumbling around that would be a huge edge for Wisky in my mind. But a break in Wisconsin momentum, bye at wrong time. Bye at a great time for Michigan, they know they have a lot to work on and had 2 weeks to do it.
 
scarf31 said:
This and @HUNT ‘spost above are right along my line of thought. Do you trust Jack Coan against a solid defense? Michigan’s wounds have mainly been self inflicted...if they don’t turn the football over and win the battle along the lines of scrimmage (which I think they can), they are dead even at WORST with Wisconsin.

I do think Shea is on a short leash and think Cub nailed it in that even stubborn-as-shit JH knows this new offense with Shea isn’t clicking...this is a conference game where the stake is much higher...think we definitely see the kid getting more time and sometimes that’s what an offense needs...a kick in the ass wake up call.

This game was Michigan -6.5/7 two weeks ago...if you’re telling me Michigan is now 10.5 points worse in the pointspread in the last 14 days I call bullshit.

Did we already forget that an OU team last year that made the playoff also needed OT to bear Army? Has Michigan looked like ass so far, yes. Has Wisconsin looked amazing so far, yes.

If Wisky looks half as good as they have in the first two games and Michigan keeps turning the football over and loses the TO battle, Badgers will win.

But giving me more than a FG in an expected low scoring game with the better coach and a bye week to prepare? I’m all over that. And if Michigan dare I say wins the TO battle...they win by 7-10.
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:pray:

I hope to god you are right, I really do. I'd gladly lose money for a Michigan win..either way I'm happy
 
HUNT said:
:pray:

I hope to god you are right, I really do. I'd gladly lose money for a Michigan win..either way I'm happy.
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Buying the guaranteed victory (one way or another)...the oldest trick in the book! :moneytoss:
 
My Michigan gear will be on...down to the jordan shoes. Just used to disappointment.

Let's go.
 
scarf31 said:
Buying the guaranteed victory (one way or another)...the oldest trick in the book! :moneytoss:
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It's a great move. You can get the home team a victory or if they lose not only do you win but you can say 'I told ya all'.
 
B.A.R. said:
It's a great move. You can get the home team a victory or if they lose not only do you win but you can say 'I told ya all'.
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ha, I would never say that. Just believe my eyes for this one...but hey, it's off a bye and I have hope they can get to Coan with some exotic shit...who knows...I'm excited and want to see the "true" teams here.
 
HUNT said:
ha, I would never say that. Just believe my eyes for this one...but hey, it's off a bye and I have hope they can get to Coan with some exotic shit...who knows...I'm excited and want to see the "true" teams here.
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Oh, I wasn't talking about you. Lol. Yeah, I'm curious to see Wisconsin in general... And see what Michigan does both ways. I'm very curious what Brown decides to 'give' to Wisconsin. I think it will surprise.
 
B.A.R. said:
Oh, I wasn't talking about you. Lol. Yeah, I'm curious to see Wisconsin in general... And see what Michigan does both ways. I'm very curious what Brown decides to 'give' to Wisconsin. I think it will surprise.
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Hope so. Props to Michigan bettors if it hits. I'd never think it..but not the first or last time i'd be wrong.
 
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