The NBA Finals : Heat vs Lakers Discussion

Besides an injury to Lebron or Davis , what do the heat have to do to win this series ?
 
Outside of LeBron and AD, who can the lakers count on for offense?

heat don’t have the superstar but I think they play great team basketball. Plus ES will not get out coached.
 
ISU74 said:
Outside of LeBron and AD, who can the lakers count on for offense?

heat don’t have the superstar but I think they play great team basketball. Plus ES will not get out coached.
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I haven’t seen anything in these playoffs that suggest they are vulnerable because they dont have a consistent third scorer
 
The Lakers have the best two players in the series but Miami has what, the next 4 or 5 best?

I still think the Lakers win but the series price seems too high. You have to respect what the Heat have done. A sweep, a demolition of a great Bucks team in 5, and then they beat a great Celtics team in 6. 12-3 in the playoffs vs real teams.

A dog with a bunch of dogs and a don't give a fuck attitude. They are going to be a very tough out.
 
JohnnyGambler said:
The Lakers have the best two players in the series but Miami has what, the next 4 or 5 best?

I still think the Lakers win but the series price seems too high. You have to respect what the Heat have done. A sweep, a demolition of a great Bucks team in 5, and then they beat a great Celtics team in 6. 12-3 in the playoffs vs real teams.

A dog with a bunch of dogs and a don't give a fuck attitude. They are going to be a very tough out.
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giannis was hurt , Celtics great?

I think they can get more than 1 game , but AD is a matchup nightmare and Lebron is Lebron

Lebron and AD> the next 5 Heat players
 
I would drop Lebron out of top 10 if he loses this series :)

2011 Mavs , 2010 Celtics

he’d have some real ugly losses on that resume
 
I would say those concerns were answered after the nuggets series , that was a concern once the Clips lost
 
It was ugly for Lebron , I gotta look up his stats but I remember his plus minus in G6 was bad
 
B.A.R. said:
Play their game.

Shoot well.

They definitely are capable of it.
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Get hot from 3. AD gets in foul trouble or starts falling in love with the perimeter.
Though LAL seem like the team of destiny, in a normal year I might think some value in Mia at +350ish..
 
You seen that I been very confident in the first three series of this postseason. 4 - 1 was more or less what I expected in all 3.
This one is different. Won't go as far as 50 - 50, but 51 - 49 in Lakers favor.
I think that Heat the best team built to face the Lakers, besides the Clippers.
Butler and Iggy on Bron, Bam on Davis... Don't forget that Davis still hurt and no one knows how fit he will be (even if I assume he plays unless he simply can't).
If I had to make a mold to produce player that would fit Heat culture and roster, Iggy and Butler would be the samples - great add ons and will bring the veteran presence to the younger Heat (plus Drugic of course).
Heat are deep, resilient, unselfish and have great defense. They the upgraded Denver - that lacked the defense and the veteran presence. They also the upgraded Rockets, because they can shoot three pointers, but have presence in the paint.

Still, you can't count out the Lakers and that's due to 2 reasons:
1) Defense. I think that Lakers play best defense in the bubble by huge margin. Bucks and Boston are good, but Heat have yet to see such type of defense and when we add all things together, Heat can struggle to put up points on the board. Everything that was said on Heat fit to defend Lakers, can be said in reverse. Davis can guard Bam, Rondo can abuse Dragic, Bron doesn't even have to defend Jimmy. Green/ KCP can do that and keep Bron fresh on offense - and that's huge for him.

2) LeBron - Spoelstra obviously knows him, but still... He will be the best player on court and it's hard to argue his basketball IQ. He can do help defense, something that he does very good and should be fresh enough on offense. He really should watch closely the series Heat played the Bucks, since I assume the strategy of them on Bron will be similar to what they did on Giannis and that can be an advantage of some kind, because playing the Bucks, forced Heat to show their hand, maybe a bit too early.

Add to that Rondo and Caruso that appear to be in great form, Dwight that finally can take the ship and can help keep Davis fresh by guarding Bam for some minutes, after losing to the Lakers last time he was in the Finals (in the same Orlando they are now). In the end, Lakers not only Davis and Bron. They so good, they take all the spotlight, but I think that Lakers are pretty deep as well.

I think that Game 1 is crucial. Lakers don't want to chase Heat in this series. Heat not the Rockets or the Blazers. Losing Game 1, can be very problematic. If I'm the Lakers, I go all in on Game 1.
We will see how it goes. For now, don't have any forecast, but on paper, Heat odds have huge value imo...
 
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For the heat to have a chance they are gonna have to find a way to get on the glass. Bam is gonna have to be huge in dealing w not only AD, but Dwight, JaVale, etc. I’d expect Olynuk to play for mia and need to give them significant minutes
 
divol said:
You seen that I been very confident in the first three series of this postseason. 4 - 1 was more or less what I expected in all 3.
This one is different. Won't go as far as 50 - 50, but 51 - 49 in Lakers favor.
I think that Heat the best team built to face the Lakers, besides the Clippers.
Butler and Iggy on Bron, Bam on Davis... Don't forget that Davis still hurt and no one knows how fit he will be (even if I assume he plays unless he simply can't).
If I had to make a mold to produce player that would fit Heat culture and roster, Iggy and Butler would be the samples - great add ons and will bring the veteran presence to the younger Heat (plus Drugic of course).
Heat are deep, resilient, unselfish and have great defense. They the upgraded Denver - that lacked the defense and the veteran presence. They also the upgraded Rockets, because they can shoot three pointers, but have presence in the paint.

Still, you can't count out the Lakers and that's due to 2 reasons:
1) Defense. I think that Lakers play best defense in the bubble by huge margin. Bucks and Boston are good, but Heat have yet to see such type of defense and when we add all things together, Heat can struggle to put up points on the board. Everything that was said on Heat fit to defend Lakers, can be said in reverse. Davis can guard Bam, Rondo can abuse Dragic, Bron doesn't even have to defend Jimmy. Green/ KCP can do that and keep Bron fresh on offense - and that's huge for him.

2) LeBron - Spoelstra obviously knows him, but still... He will be the best player on court and it's hard to argue his basketball IQ. He can do help defense, something that he does very good and should be fresh enough on offense. He really should watch closely the series Heat played the Bucks, since I assume the strategy of them on Bron will be similar to what they did on Giannis and that can be an advantage of some kind, because playing the Bucks, forced Heat to show their hand, maybe a bit too early.

Add to that Rondo and Caruso that appear to be in great form, Dwight that finally can take the ship and can help keep Davis fresh by guarding Bam for some minutes, after losing to the Lakers last time he was in the Finals (in the same Orlando they are now). In the end, Lakers not only Davis and Bron. They so good, they take all the spotlight, but I think that Lakers are pretty deep as well.

I think that Game 1 is crucial. Lakers don't want to chase Heat in this series. Heat not the Rockets or the Blazers. Losing Game 1, can be very problematic. If I'm the Lakers, I go all in on Game 1.
We will see how it goes. For now, don't have any forecast, but on paper, Heat odds have huge value imo...
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I fully agree, Butler always guards Lebron well, and there are Iguodala and Crowder to switch on him as well. As far as AD, Bam is one of rare guys who can somewhat slow him down. I also expect Olynyk to play more minutes this series, Miami has a lot of depth and they can decide who to use more depending on matchups. Heat will need Robinson and Herro on top of their game, they are inexperienced at this stage, but if they can play at high level as they did so far, they can make a big difference. With Bron probably not dominating as much in this series (as in game 5), Lakers will need Rondo to take over in some games. Should be a helluva series.
 
Only 2 guys on the Heat that I trust the most from the East to stop LeBitch. Spols and Riley's game plan. They know his weakness, all his strengths and they have the players to put on him. Divol sums it up and same thoughts of how I feel about the Heat and I've been playing them every game. My local has -350/+290 currently and I will most likely take a stab at whats being offered, plus I want LeBitch to lose AGAIN!
 
This is an idiotic series price. Lakers have beaten the 3 4 and 8 in the West. Who wouldn't get to the Finals facing that path? Miami significantly better as a whole than the individual parts...and have beaten the 1 3 and 4 in the East. Heat would be best to let the old man go nuts and average 50/game and make AD's life a living hell facing nonstop double teams. If LeBitch and the Lakers scrubs hitting 3s (not a given) are enough to beat Miami, then my hat's off to LeBitch.

But I think Miami wins this series in 5 or 6 TBH. This is a 04 Stones Final matchup IMO. Peeps getting swayed because one team wears gold and purple. Will definitely be looking for Heat to win in 5/6 props for shits and giggles.
 
Seen it a few times today but worth mentioning that Waiters Island is guaranteed a ring ;)
 
braves said:
Kobe was awful in that series from what I remember
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In the series? Yeah...other than game 2 he was bad. That was a big part of that series...Detroit D on him and Kobe wanting to force things instead of feeding Shaq. Obviously, that relationship was horrid then.
 
As time goes on the 2004 Pistons stuff gets more and more baffling to me. It's not like some plucky David slayed Goliath. Fact is that Pistons team had the 2nd best point differential in the regular season that year and first in the playoffs. They were almost 4 fucking points better than the Lakers during that season.

Wow just looked and the Lakers were -550 in that series!!! That is INSANE.
 
How much money could you have made 15-20 years ago if you were ahead of your time on analytics or even something as basic as point differential? No wonder Haralabob made millions during these years.
 
Also not to get to narrative driven but LeBron in his 10th finals and in the year Kobe passed. Doesn't it just seem like destiny that they finish the job?
 
JohnnyGambler said:
As time goes on the 2004 Pistons stuff gets more and more baffling to me. It's not like some plucky David slayed Goliath. Fact is that Pistons team had the 2nd best point differential in the regular season that year and first in the playoffs. They were almost 4 fucking points better than the Lakers during that season.

Wow just looked and the Lakers were -550 in that series!!! That is INSANE.
Click to expand...

I don't think anyone knew how toxic the relationship between Shaq and Kobe really was, it would have never been hidden like that in the social media era of today
 
JohnnyGambler said:
Also not to get to narrative driven but LeBron in his 10th finals and in the year Kobe passed. Doesn't it just seem like destiny that they finish the job?
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that, and I think Lebron knows that this is basically his last real GREAT shot at a title. Next year the West with the Warriors back gets even more difficult

Lebron has been great in finals ( I think) since the 2011 debacle. I don't have any doubt he will be great in this series.
 
The NBA Finals start on Wednesday and LeBron James has played in 49 career NBA Finals games.

Here is Cleveland and Miami's all-time betting records in the NBA Finals with him on the team:

SU: 18-31
ATS: 19-28-2
OU: 22-23-4

Those teams are also 1-8 SU and 2-7 ATS in Game 1s.
 
braves said:
giannis was hurt , Celtics great?

I think they can get more than 1 game , but AD is a matchup nightmare and Lebron is Lebron

Lebron and AD> the next 5 Heat players
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giannis getting hurt is the only reason that series went 5. It was a sweep with a healthy giannis.
 
braves said:
that, and I think Lebron knows that this is basically his last real GREAT shot at a title. Next year the West with the Warriors back gets even more difficult

Lebron has been great in finals ( I think) since the 2011 debacle. I don't have any doubt he will be great in this series.
Click to expand...

Agree here the Disney Invitational is his last shot.
 
H.R. Pufnstuf said:
The NBA Finals start on Wednesday and LeBron James has played in 49 career NBA Finals games.

Here is Cleveland and Miami's all-time betting records in the NBA Finals with him on the team:

SU: 18-31
ATS: 19-28-2
OU: 22-23-4

Those teams are also 1-8 SU and 2-7 ATS in Game 1s.
Click to expand...

Cramps has only been favored in the opening game of the Finals twice, he's gone 1-1 SU and ATS.

Most of the time in the Finals, Cramps is going against the superior team. His most recent Cavs teams were terrible.

His last 22 Finals games were against the Dubs Dynasty (7-15 SU), prior to that was 12 Finals games against Timmay's Spurs (5-7 SU).

This is easily his best shot at a title since he faced the mental midget Thunder team back in the 2011/12 season.

Btw, the 2004 Pistons would have swept this Meat team 4-0 if they met in a series and beaten this Lakers team 4-1.
 
Hard to go against Lakers with Lebron and AD , but the Heat have a toughness and togetherness that can give the Lakers all they can handle. They remind me a little of the 2004 Pistons in that regard. Obviously they don’t play defense like that team but nobody else does these days either. Should be a great series but I like Miami.
 
They were never ever close to the 2004 Pistons.

If COVID never appeared the Heat wouldn't have sniffed the Finals.
 
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