So, what have we learned? - NFL Week 7

I feel bad for Josh Freeman. If anyone should lose their job over that last night it should be Leslie Frazier. You have a QB with two weeks in your system and the best RB in the game. The plan should have been 35 hand offs to AP. Instead you have Freeman chuck it 50 times? WTF was the plan? Was he trying to make the ownership and fan base understand something about Freeman? From what I understand Freeman was co signed by Frazier. Just doesn't make any sense. The guys confidence has got to be crushed today.
 
I think the gameplan was probably pretty simple: "The Giants will load up to stop AP because we're starting a QB who doesn't know our offense. FREEMAN SHOULD THROW ALL OF THE FOOTBALLS!"
 
Honestly, if I were Freeman I wouldn't give a shit. He's got half a season (less if he sucks out loud) to make a case that he's got a good enough arm and enough potential that some team should sign him as a free agent. I'd want to throw the ball a lot. It's an audition in live action, if the team that ends up wanting me is Minny, so be it but either way I think you look at it like a business decision.
 
Nick Foles is 2-6 as starting QB for the Eagles with both wins coming against the Bucs.

It's Matt Barkley time. Chip and the Birds need to stop pissing around. Vick and Nick are not worthy.
 
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The Reid gif is an all time classic. The real clip is actually pretty cool too. The players were chanting his name an he comes running in like that to a hero's welcome. Tis a different time in Chiefs Kingdom this year.

I had a rough week. But this what I think:

- Chiefs won't get to Denver or the bye undefeated. I think they will lose at Buffalo in Week 9. I don't know if I will back them against NO this week, but this team is not bad at all. Pretty darn close to being 4-3, 5-2.

- Those worried about the Chiefs offense, they have scored at least 17 in every game. And have yet to allow more than 17. I understand the "who have they beaten" argument. But besides the Colts, how many teams actually have some impressive wins on their resume? By some I mean more than one.

- Denver should be fine, but they have certainly come back to earth the last few weeks. An aggressive defense will give them trouble every time. No Trent Richardson fumble and that game could have gotten out of hand.

- Carson Palmer is flat out horrendous.

- I think going back to Schaub is a mistake. Schaub would not have done what Keenum was able to do the other day. Ship is sinking, hand the reigns over.

- That was a painful MNF game. So bad.

- The Patriots are in some trouble.

- Those asking for Matt Barkley. Did you watch the game and have action on Philly? I did. He isn't close to ready.

Nothing too deep here. Just some quick thoughts. GL to everyone this week.

-
 
Also, part of the reason I bet the Birds vs. the Bucs was because Nick Foles beat them last time. Total confidence thing for him. That plus the Bucs being awful made it a play.

But this is exactly what some of us bitched about before the season with Vick. So Vick gets hurt—as we knew he would—so now we throw Foles in there and after one bad game the calls start for Barkley. It's ridiculous.

Barkley's not ready and Foles has barely had a shot in this system. I don't know if he's the guy or not, but I don't think anybody does. I wasn't crazy about the way the front office handled the QB situation over the summer and I'm still not thrilled with it now.
 
JumpOnBoard said:
@Adv_NFL_Stats: J.Freeman had -15.9 EPA last night, meaning if rest of team were avg, his performance alone would theoretically result in a loss by 16 pts.
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Thats not even mentioning the Giants were the worst defense in the league coming into the game, like historically bad. That the Giants played 9 in the box to stop AP and Freeman still couldn't come within 10 yards of a wr.
 
It's not about 1 bad game, JP. Barkley - at least imo, is the better QB of the 3. He's also the most 'wholesome' off the field and won't carry the bad karma Vick's ass has.
 
Joe Public said:
That Fat Andy thing is spectacular.

And thanks for the tip, Austinhous.

=)
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i like Andy Reid. I hate the Eagles but feel he did a good job as the eagles HC. And the fact that the eagles fired him the same year he lost his son doesn't sit well with me. Shit move in my opinion. I wish him well.
 
I think that was bad timing as much as anything, Mo. His tenure had really run its course. He's a great coach no matter what you hear from anybody, that's the truth. But even the great ones hit the wall. And where he was with the defense and the QB situation, combined with a truly awful season opened up the window. It was time to either turn almost the entire roster over—which he was never going to do, or move on with someone who would.

By the start of next season, save for a couple of spots, this team will look dramatically different than it did under Reid. And that was best for the franchise. I wish they guy well. He was truly great for Philly football and I think most Birds fans accept that, even if some of 'em do so reluctantly.
 
It's not about 1 bad game, JP. Barkley - at least imo, is the better QB of the 3. He's also the most 'wholesome' off the field and won't carry the bad karma Vick's ass has.

Wait, we care about wholesome all of the sudden? I feel like I know you, Em (at least somewhat), so I'm virtually certain that's not code for Vick not being white enough. Although I'm sure there's a small part of the fan base that wants a white QB back. What a living hell it must have been for them going from Randall to McNabb to Vick, while under the tyrannical rule of a black president no less. Thank God we have Riley Cooper on the roster to give them something to hold onto.

Ha. Sorry. Like I said, I'm sure that's not what you meant.

But honestly I think Birds fans care less about Ron Mexico's baggage than his inability to stay on the field. He's like Lucy with the football, every time you start to believe the guy's healthy and it's all good, he gets hurt again. AND YOU KNOW IT'S GOING TO HAPPEN. Yet for some reason you tell yourself this time it's different.

I have no idea if Foles is any good, honestly. I think he's probably decent—not that that's the goal. But I'm not sure either he or Barkley have had enough time in the system to really maximize any potential they have. Mostly because they've never been the number one, and in Barkley's case also because he's so raw.

I'm fine with giving the rookie the chance—or Foles the chance really, just as long as it's an honest shot. This three games and you're on the scrap heap isn't something I believe in for any team. Tell one of them he's the guy the rest of the way and see what happens.

Of course, we know that won't happen. Vick will come back, and we'll be right back where we were a couple of weeks ago, waiting for Vick to pull up lame with no clear cut idea of who's taking this team over when he does.
 
Joe Public said:
It's not about 1 bad game, JP. Barkley - at least imo, is the better QB of the 3. He's also the most 'wholesome' off the field and won't carry the bad karma Vick's ass has.

Wait, we care about wholesome all of the sudden? I feel like I know you, Em (at least somewhat), so I'm virtually certain that's not code for Vick not being white enough. Although I'm sure there's a small part of the fan base that wants a white QB back. What a living hell it must have been for them going from Randall to McNabb to Vick, while under the tyrannical rule of a black president no less. Thank God we have Riley Cooper on the roster to give them something to hold onto.

Ha. Sorry. Like I said, I'm sure that's not what you meant.

But honestly I think Birds fans care less about Ron Mexico's baggage than his inability to stay on the field. He's like Lucy with the football, every time you start to believe the guy's healthy and it's all good, he gets hurt again. AND YOU KNOW IT'S GOING TO HAPPEN. Yet for some reason you tell yourself this time it's different.

I have no idea if Foles is any good, honestly. I think he's probably decent—not that that's the goal. But I'm not sure either he or Barkley have had enough time in the system to really maximize any potential they have. Mostly because they've never been the number one, and in Barkley's case also because he's so raw.

I'm fine with giving the rookie the chance—or Foles the chance really, just as long as it's an honest shot. This three games and you're on the scrap heap isn't something I believe in for any team. Tell one of them he's the guy the rest of the way and see what happens.

Of course, we know that won't happen. Vick will come back, and we'll be right back where we were a couple of weeks ago, waiting for Vick to pull up lame with no clear cut idea of who's taking this team over when he does.
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Jeez Joey, sometimes......
 
Coverdatspred said:
What was his point? I've been trying to figure this out all morning.
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Frazier wanted nothing to do with Freeman coming in. Owner and GM pushed for it and Frazier publicly is/was going along with it. He knowingly threw him out there last night before he was ready and threw nearly everydown. Made it pretty easy the whole second half for NYG defense to see what was coming. There is no other excuse for why AD didn't get more carries. It's not like he hasn't seen 9 in the box before. That happens every game.
 
P-Unit said:
Frazier wanted nothing to do with Freeman coming in. Owner and GM pushed for it and Frazier publicly is/was going along with it. He knowingly threw him out there last night before he was ready and threw nearly everydown. Made it pretty easy the whole second half for NYG defense to see what was coming. There is no other excuse for why AD didn't get more carries. It's not like he hasn't seen 9 in the box before. That happens every game.
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This all come out today?
 
twinkie13 said:
This all come out today?
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that's been the buzz on local radio and TV in town here since shortly after he signed.

Frazier's a nice guy. Probably too nice. Hence, he's not going to publicly come out like a Parcells or Belicheck would do if they didn't like the move.
 
Joe Public said:
It's not about 1 bad game, JP. Barkley - at least imo, is the better QB of the 3. He's also the most 'wholesome' off the field and won't carry the bad karma Vick's ass has.

Wait, we care about wholesome all of the sudden? I feel like I know you, Em (at least somewhat), so I'm virtually certain that's not code for Vick not being white enough. Although I'm sure there's a small part of the fan base that wants a white QB back. What a living hell it must have been for them going from Randall to McNabb to Vick, while under the tyrannical rule of a black president no less. Thank God we have Riley Cooper on the roster to give them something to hold onto.

Ha. Sorry. Like I said, I'm sure that's not what you meant.

But honestly I think Birds fans care less about Ron Mexico's baggage than his inability to stay on the field. He's like Lucy with the football, every time you start to believe the guy's healthy and it's all good, he gets hurt again. AND YOU KNOW IT'S GOING TO HAPPEN. Yet for some reason you tell yourself this time it's different.

I have no idea if Foles is any good, honestly. I think he's probably decent—not that that's the goal. But I'm not sure either he or Barkley have had enough time in the system to really maximize any potential they have. Mostly because they've never been the number one, and in Barkley's case also because he's so raw.

I'm fine with giving the rookie the chance—or Foles the chance really, just as long as it's an honest shot. This three games and you're on the scrap heap isn't something I believe in for any team. Tell one of them he's the guy the rest of the way and see what happens.

Of course, we know that won't happen. Vick will come back, and we'll be right back where we were a couple of weeks ago, waiting for Vick to pull up lame with no clear cut idea of who's taking this team over when he does.
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Most definitely not what I meant, Joe. Geez, man. I despise racism. 'Wholesome' meaning he's not guilty of killing fucking animals - namely dogs, Vick just brings bad karma to the Birds, imo - Barkley is a full blown Christian and may carry the holy power like Tebow did in that year he had in Denver, upside is Matt the Christian can actually throw the damn ball. At this stage I'm willing to go with anything that may help my beloved Birds win be it black, white, hispanic, pacific islander or asian.

Advocated for the kid when he was at USC, always thought he'd make a successful transition into the pros. As for Foles, guy has looked good in spots and like shit in others. He just doesn't have that 'winning feel' about him for me personally...
 
I didn't think it about you man, really, that's why I qualified it so much. Because I read it and thought the racial side of it didn't sound like you. Honestly, no offense intended.

And to that point, I should admit that being a big ol' liberal sometimes we hear dog-whistles in the dark when they just aren't there. In fact, just today I had a guy throw out the 'it's not funny to say player XYZ strained his vagina because it's demeaning to women' on Facebook. Swear to God. I mean, do I get where he's coming from, yes. But for fuck's sake, man, the shit gets tiring sometimes.

I also didn't know Barkley's a holy roller. I only really followed him in college from afar, to me there was always a lot of hype with him like there was with all those USC guys and I kind of did that 'I'll believe it when I see it' thing.

But that he's all Tebowed out makes sense in the contrast with Vick. And obviously as a Birds fan I've got a vested interest in him making the transition too. But for me, he and Foles feel very similar from the standpoint that I think they both need to be coached up. Which is what made Philly a good situation for Foles under Andy and what may kill him under Chip.

I'm not sure Kelly's system fits Foles, or Barkley. But with that said, I take Kelly at his word when he says he will adapt his system to the NFL. What I really think it will come down to with whoever they go with—even if that guy isn't on the roster yet—is coaching. To me Kelly feels like he has a very specific idea of what he wants from his QB and my biggest worry isn't just that neither Foles nor Barkley may be it, but that he'll churn through guys for two and a half years never finding who he likes only to get fired and leave us with no one under center.

If he does that, well, let's just say I've seen what ten years with no real QB looks like. It's called the Cleveland Browns and it sucks balls.
 
Joe Public said:
I didn't think it about you man, really, that's why I qualified it so much. Because I read it and thought the racial side of it didn't sound like you. Honestly, no offense intended.

And to that point, I should admit that being a big ol' liberal sometimes we hear dog-whistles in the dark when they just aren't there. In fact, just today I had a guy throw out the 'it's not funny to say player XYZ strained his vagina because it's demeaning to women' on Facebook. Swear to God. I mean, do I get where he's coming from, yes. But for fuck's sake, man, the shit gets tiring sometimes.

I also didn't know Barkley's a holy roller. I only really followed him in college from afar, to me there was always a lot of hype with him like there was with all those USC guys and I kind of did that 'I'll believe it when I see it' thing.

But that he's all Tebowed out makes sense in the contrast with Vick. And obviously as a Birds fan I've got a vested interest in him making the transition too. But for me, he and Foles feel very similar from the standpoint that I think they both need to be coached up. Which is what made Philly a good situation for Foles under Andy and what may kill him under Chip.

I'm not sure Kelly's system fits Foles, or Barkley. But with that said, I take Kelly at his word when he says he will adapt his system to the NFL. What I really think it will come down to with whoever they go with—even if that guy isn't on the roster yet—is coaching. To me Kelly feels like he has a very specific idea of what he wants from his QB and my biggest worry isn't just that neither Foles nor Barkley may be it, but that he'll churn through guys for two and a half years never finding who he likes only to get fired and leave us with no one under center.

If he does that, well, let's just say I've seen what ten years with no real QB looks like. It's called the Cleveland Browns and it sucks balls.
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:thumbsup2:
 
No offense taken, Joe. Sometimes the interwebs doesn't translate things that well.

Twink got it pretty much right,

Not so much a felon, but a felon who harmed/slaughtered those that can't defend themselves vs a dude that goes on 'Jesus missions' to 3rd world countries.

Apart from that one okay season in 10/11, the Birds have gone rapidly downhill in the Vick era. The 'Football Gods' just don't want this dude to succeed, period.
 
Joe Public said:
I didn't think it about you man, really, that's why I qualified it so much. Because I read it and thought the racial side of it didn't sound like you. Honestly, no offense intended.

And to that point, I should admit that being a big ol' liberal sometimes we hear dog-whistles in the dark when they just aren't there. In fact, just today I had a guy throw out the 'it's not funny to say player XYZ strained his vagina because it's demeaning to women' on Facebook. Swear to God. I mean, do I get where he's coming from, yes. But for fuck's sake, man, the shit gets tiring sometimes.

I also didn't know Barkley's a holy roller. I only really followed him in college from afar, to me there was always a lot of hype with him like there was with all those USC guys and I kind of did that 'I'll believe it when I see it' thing.

But that he's all Tebowed out makes sense in the contrast with Vick. And obviously as a Birds fan I've got a vested interest in him making the transition too. But for me, he and Foles feel very similar from the standpoint that I think they both need to be coached up. Which is what made Philly a good situation for Foles under Andy and what may kill him under Chip.

I'm not sure Kelly's system fits Foles, or Barkley. But with that said, I take Kelly at his word when he says he will adapt his system to the NFL. What I really think it will come down to with whoever they go with—even if that guy isn't on the roster yet—is coaching. To me Kelly feels like he has a very specific idea of what he wants from his QB and my biggest worry isn't just that neither Foles nor Barkley may be it, but that he'll churn through guys for two and a half years never finding who he likes only to get fired and leave us with no one under center.

If he does that, well, let's just say I've seen what ten years with no real QB looks like. It's called the Cleveland Browns and it sucks balls.
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Regarding the whole bad karma thing, doesn't Jerry Sandusky's kid work as the Browns Player Personnel Director.
 
The 'Football Gods' just don't want this dude to succeed, period.

I believe in this. Also, I love dogs and it's taken a lot for me to pretend that Ron Mexico is not a flaming asshole who deserves to have all his fame stripped from him and spend the rest of his days working in some shitty Denny's off a desolate highway in Mississippi somewhere. Why? Because good people deserve to work in good places, and assholes deserve to work in places nobody wants to go to.

Of course if going on missions for Christ were the answer, Tim Tebow would still be in the league. Oh, Timmay, how the mighty have Tebowed you.

Regarding the whole bad karma thing, doesn't Jerry Sandusky's kid work as the Browns Player Personnel Director.

Yes. And he was busted for a DUI earlier this month. So, you know, the Browns have that going for them too. If you'll excuse me, I'm now going to go weep quietly in the corner.
 
Enough about the pathetic Eagles.

Joe - quit playing possum and tell us how the Brownies are going to fuck up all the teasers and squeak out a win this weekend at Arrowhead. Chiefs getting a lotta love and they deserve it to a degree but they haven't played a good team yet, and I'm not sure I could lay a TD with them vs. many NFL teams......

CLE shaping up to be a big play for me on Sunday
 
Ha. Good question. Well, they could cover, maybe. I'd feel safer with a teaser, but even then I'd want it at +14 or better. But here's the argument for how they cover.

Jason Campbell would need to the ball like Steny Hoyer
I don't mean it would have to look like how Hoyer did it, just that they'd need to let Campbell sling the rock around they way they did with Hoyer. Maybe it's just me, but it didn't seem like Weeden threw as much as Hoyer. Although you look at his numbers and his attempts are up there (42 last week, albeit they were behind the whole game). But they'd have to let Campbell throw.

Their OL would have to perform great
KC gets good pressure and the right side of the Browns' OL tends to leak. If the Browns can't hold off KC's DL, it's going to be a long, long day.

Cameron & Gordon need to have a big day
When I look at this game I see no way KC doesn't put up points. Not like 35—although you never know with turnovers/special teams—but probably in the mid-to-high 20s. So if Cleveland is going to stay within the number I think they have to put up at least 20, to win 24. No way that happens without Cameron and Jordan

Turnovers
Get Smith to turn the ball over three times and Jason Campbell can keep you inside 8 points.

With all that said, I think at best you're looking at 20-13 KC, more likely 27/24-13.
 
If I know Andy's gameplan from all his time in the NFC East, he'll come out conservative and wait for Cleveland to fuck up and give them points. Browns have the league's ninth best run defense so I don't expect KC to be able to simply run the ball all day against them unless Cleveland turns it over a ton.

Campbell probably not much of a dropoff from either of the other QB's at this point. I see a close one
 
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