BCS-ologists, lend your thoughts

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tipyerbartender1

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Nothing against Rutgers and Boise, shame there's no playoffs. Ridiculous that our assumptions about their undefeated Division I football teams can't be tested on the field. But anyway ...

Don't this week's upsets aplenty set up a possibility of a virtual semi-finals of ND-USC and OSU-Mich?

USC still has to get past Cal (and UCLA after ND), and ND has Army.

Does more crazy shit have to happen with Florida and Arkansas or am I on the money here, what do you think?

Starting to get a bit excited about this possibility, didn't think it possible until Louisville, Texas, and Auburn all shit the bed. Go Irish.
 
In related news, ND can really put a hammerlock on that commander-in-chief trophy next weekend.
 
i was thinking about this tonight too...

Must say though, when trying to revise rankings...i got totally fucking confused. This crazy weekend sure threw a couple Mouse wrenches into the whole picture. Anyways, here's what i came up with. Note...the caveat is that i gave up, and simply threw out all the teams with 2 losses. It was the only way that wasn't compeltely confusing and ridiculous, imo.

That said...i can think of a half dozen two loss teams that i think would beat half the teams on this list, including the two lessor undefeatededs.
But for simplicities sake...fuck 'em. The two loss teams don't deserve to be talked about for the national championship anyways.

So, again for simplicity's sake...and because i was confusing the shit outta myself trying to rank teams after this weekend's games...here's my new rankings, not counting any two loss teams.
Yes, many of them are better than what's on this list...but fuck the double losers. I totally gave up trying to find the right rankign for them...so this only includes the undefeated or one loss teams as of tonight.


1 - Ohio St (11-0)
2 - Michigan (11-0)
3 - USC (8-1)
4 - Florida (9-1)...and very lucky they're not at 2 losses too.
5 - Notre Dame (9-1)
6 - Arkansas (9-1)
7 - Rutgers (9-0)
8 - Wisconsin (10-1)
9 - Wake Forest (9-1)
10 - Boise St (10-0)...and very lucky to not have a loss today.
11 - Louisville (8-1)
12 - W Virginia (8-1)

Just my 2 cents...removing all the two loss teams, since they're completely outta the picture for the championship game. That said...so are most of these teams here, in reality.

IMO...Ohio St and Michigan should jsut play twice. Don't like it...but the USC/ND winner isn't better than either of these teams, imo. And FLA has been very fortunate in a few games now.

In any case, once you do include the 2 loss teams...as any real poll would...i seriously came up with over 10 scenarios, in terms of where to place them...and when to place them above a one loss or no loss team. for example, LSU/TX/CAL or quite a few other 2 loss teams would flat out destroy 1/2 the teams on this list of 12.
There's jsut no one logical way to place them all in a list of 25. So i gave up completely, as i said, and went with this bullshit.


Kinda interested though to see what the BCS spits out...
 
G-Man, they're good but cooked with two losses as far as the national championship goes, as Yanks said.
 
What's with all the LSU sentiment? This isn't the SEC championship thread. LSU is not getting into the national championship picture with 2 losses, that's just the BCS for better or worse.
 
1 - Ohio St (11-0)
2 - Michigan (11-0)
3 - USC (8-1)
4 - Florida (9-1)
5 - Notre Dame (9-1)
6 - Arkansas (9-1)
7 - Rutgers (9-0)

Alright how does it all shake out? I think OSU beats Mich, that knocks Michigan to 11-1. I think USC beats CAL, ND, & UCLA. That will move them up to #2. I think Florida loses to Arkansas in the SEC Championship which knocks them out. Then WVU takes out Rutgers last week of the yr to give the BCS a big sign of relief. You will be left with..

1-OSU - (12-0)
2-USC - (11-1)
3-Arky - (12-1) *Win SEC championship
4-Mich - (11-1)
5-Just starting shuffling teams as everyone here is in a cluster..
 
lsu is a great roster with 2 losses.. Plain and simple. They lost 2 out of their 3 big games and the rest of the games theyve won they have beat up on shitty teams, their wins are basically the same as wisconsins...

Why is lsu bein brought up?
 
HUNTDOG said:
um osu rematch.

If its a classic 3point game, I would agree here however, anything in the 7-10+ range and I think it is USC's shot if they run the table..

It would be hard to justify a ND-OSU championship if Mich does lose and ND beats USC...Mich beat the crap out of them and I can't see how you can give them a shot before you give Mich another one..
 
Just on a side note.. Ohio st has played 2 teams in the top 30 all year.. WOW

SC is 5 - 1 against teams in the top 30.. and all 3 remaining games that they play teams are in the top 30. That would be a total of 9 teams :drink: compared to ohio st's 3.


Before Ohio st fans have a heart attack and say but and if.. im just stating the schedules. And like i mentioned to jump.. how many teams has ohio st faced with an offense ranked in the top 30.

I remember uga had played garbage the first 4 games and had the #1 defense and got exposed. Im not saying that will happen to tosu but stats can be very very misleading
 
Texas #3
Minny #38
N Illinois #41
Mich st #44
Iowa #60
Penn ST #70
Illinois #88
Cincy #92
NW #107
Indiana #66
Bowling Green #84

A lot of offensive powerhouses.. I am just bringing an unbiased perspective, since i dont care who wins this game.

Although i think ohio st does.
 
not too shabby...

1Ohio State128001.000011574.9994242523202323.9303.97651
2Michigan22688.960021513.96062524252525251.0001.97352
3USC32458.877941373.8717212222232120.8604.86997
4Florida42441.871831381.8768222021211818.8006.84954
5Notre Dame52267.809651273.8083201920222222.8405.81939
6Rutgers72024.722981082.6870232324242424.9502.786613
7Arkansas62234.797961248.7924181615191717.6809.756711
8West Virginia81864.665771113.7067161714151415.60011.657510
9Wisconsin111678.599310928.5892172118172019.7408.642815
10Louisville101711.611112884.5613191819181921.7507.64083
11LSU91846.659391054.6692121512121212.48013.602812
12Boise State131471.525413830.5270151417141616.61010.554114
13Texas121630.582111927.58861012115514.38016.51695
14Auburn151304.465715721.45781381313139.48014.46786
15California171033.368917580.368314716161513.58012.43918
16Wake Forest141341.478914724.459711139978.37017.436219
17Oklahoma161257.448916711.45149118326.26019.386817
18Georgia Tech18936.334318566.35947910101011.39015.361218
19Maryland21567.202521325.20636667610.25020.219623
20Boston College20600.214320384.2438537447.20021.219422
21Virginia Tech19694.247919420.26673104201.10023.204821
22Tennessee22397.141823213.135285511114.29018.189016
23Nebraska23396.141422228.1448202000.020NR.1021NR
24Oregon25129.04612672.0457413892.17022.087320
25Brigham Young24325.116124116.0737000000.000NR.0632NR

I wasn't that far off above, by simply throwing out all the two loss/undeserving teams...& removing them from the picture.
Looks like the only real difference in the top 12, between what i did last nite and the current BCS standings, is they left out Wake Forest...and included a two loss LSU instead.

Now i do think Wake isn't getting enough respect here...and LSU is getting a bit much, since they do have 2 losses. But like i kept saying last nite...as the caveat to all this...there are half a dozen two loss teams that imo are better than half the teams i put in the top 12.
I jsut threw out the 2 loss teams because they deserved it...and they were confusing the shit outta me last night.

Anyways, i'm jsut saying that i can understand these rankings. Also glad i wasn't too far off base w/ what i was doing. Also, though there's no arguing that the BCS is still a flawed system, at least at this point in time it looks to me like it's doing a pretty damn good job of ranking the teams appropriately. Nothing's perfect...but it's pretty good, imo.
 
fact is, USC got blown the fuck out at oregon state, it wasn't even close till the end.
 
And

HUNTDOG said:
fact is, USC got blown the fuck out at oregon state, it wasn't even close till the end.

who the fuck was the one who blew Oregon St outta the water? yep...boise st.

there are dozens examples of this...and there is no perfect answer, bottom line...because Boise St certainly isn't the #3 team in the country, after almost losing to SJST especially.

anyways...even though LSU is higher than i had them, and Wake is lower than i had them...i'm kinda ok with the current bcs standings, like i said.

seriously, a decent case can still be made for many of these teams...once you get past Ohio St and Michigan, that is.
 
I just want to point something out with the BCS... Wisky is sitting #9...

For sure...

#1 plays #2
#3 plays #5
#6 plays #8
#7 plays #11

and #4 could play #7 yet too...

That leaves Wisky as the #5-7 team in the BCS. Wisky will jump ahead of the WV/Ruters loser for sure. Wisky will hopefully jump Notre Dame if they lose. Wisky would jump in front of Arkansas if they lose to LSU or in the SEC championship game. LSU could jump ahead possibly, but I dont' think they have enough left...

So you have your 6 teams auto qualified - Boise State pretty much locked up an at large, as did the loser in the Ohio State/Michigan game. The rest are up in the air. Notre Dame gets one if they beat USC. Wisky could slip in as the 4th team even if there are other upsets out there for conference championship teams as none of the other conferences have a team that deserves an at large as a 2 or in most cases 3 loss team...
 
I would laugh my ass off at everyone if there is a rematch of tOSU/UM..if the ratings go through the roof for that game don't you think TV will play a huge role?

Of course.
 
Automatic qualification
1. The top two teams in the final BCS Standings will play in the national championship game.

2. The champions of the Atlantic Coast, Big East, Big Ten, Big 12, Pac-10 and Southeastern Conferences automatically qualify for BCS games each year.

3. One team from among the champions of Conference USA, the Mid-American Conference, the Mountain West Conference, the Sun Belt Conference, or the Western Athletic Conference automatically qualify for a BCS game if either: A. Such team is ranked in the top 12 of the final BCS Standings, or, B. Such team is ranked in the top 16 of the final BCS Standings and its ranking in the final BCS Standings is higher than that of a champion of a conference that has an annual automatic berth in one of the BCS bowls.

4. Notre Dame will automatically qualify for a BCS bowl if it is in the top eight of the final BCS Standings.
 
HUNTDOG said:
your right yanks...they need a playoff for 2-6.


yeah, the only real way to settle it is some type of playoff. but even then...say 8 teams make it, there'll be one or two one loss teams with a legitimate claim to be part of the 8.

btw...joined you on wake this week...
 
I'm looking at this and the more I think of it I don't know how Wisky gets left out of the BCS...

Here's the locks:
ACC Champ - they'll only get one team in
Big 12 Champ - they'll only get one team in
Michigan
Ohio State
Boise State

Here's the good possibilities

SEC Champ (Florida or Arkansas)
Pac 10 Champ (California or USC)
Big East Champ (Rutgers or West Virginia)

Take two of these teams:
Louisville
LSU
Wisconsin
Notre Dame

Notre Dame is in if they beat USC. Have a chance if they lose as a 2 loss team.
LSU beats Arky they have the best 2 loss chance in my opinion.

Now do you take a 2 loss LSU, a 1 loss Wisky or a 1 loss Louisville?
- Remember the bowl will take the one that gets the most fans there...
 
HUNTDOG said:

Okay so lets make this a bit easier and figure Wisky, LSU, and Louisville are fighting for the last spot (Notre Damn clinched it and Boise State doesn't lose)...

Wisky and Ville are the only 1 loss teams. LSU obviously the better team with 2 losses than both wisky and ville...

Now SOS doesn't matter as much as ticket sales and fans traveling... Wisky fans are notorious and that gives an upper hand.
 
yeah..Wisky SHOULD get it and probably would, although Louisville is the more "sexy" team.
 
Fondy

Wisconsin will not be selected for a BCS bowl because of the rule which states that only two teams from the same conference can go to the BCS bowls. Ohio State and Michigan will be picked, so Wisconsin will not be eligible.
 
Sorry to bust the midwest bubble, but a rematch of michigan /tosu would not draw the ratings as having notre dame or usc in the finals.. thats plain and simple.
 
Breakdown from ESPN Insider ...

In what was probably the craziest college football weekend since the end of the 1998 season, four upsets of top-eight teams in the BCS standings changed the face of the national title race and momentarily stole the spotlight from Ohio State and Michigan.
It began on Thursday, when Rutgers knocked off then-No. 3 Louisville to become the lone undefeated team in the Big East. That result virtually guaranteed that a one-loss team will reach the BCS National Championship Game, and no team was in better position to get there than Texas, which had a commanding lead on the other once-beaten teams in both polls and seemingly the easiest remaining schedule among the contenders.
Current BCS Standings1. Ohio State 2. Michigan 3. USC 4. Florida 5. Notre Dame Complete BCS standings But early last Saturday, No. 6 Auburn fell to unranked Georgia, which cleared the way for Florida to move up in the polls and close the gap on Texas. Just a few hours later, No. 8 Cal lost at unranked Arizona, and Florida came dangerously close to seeing its title hopes snuffed out by unranked South Carolina. The big surprise, though, came in prime time, when unranked Kansas State poured on the offense against the fifth-ranked Longhorns and came away with a 45-42 win.
Needing a timely penalty and three blocked kicks to survive the upset bid of the Gamecocks, the Gators figured to pay for it in the polls -- and they did. USC, on the strength of an impressive 35-10 win over Oregon, moved within eight points of Florida in the coaches' poll and passed the Gators to take over the No. 3 spot in the Harris poll. The rise in the polls combined with the Trojans' improved computer ratings vaulted USC to No. 3 in this week's BCS standings.
Florida isn't too far behind, but with its next two games against Western Carolina -- a weak I-AA team -- and slumping Florida State, the Gators won't have a chance to impress the voters or boost their computer ratings until the SEC Championship Game on Dec. 2. Meanwhile, USC can strengthen its lead by beating Cal and Notre Dame over the next two weeks. If the Trojans take care of the Bears on Saturday, they should move up to the coveted No. 2 spot behind the Michigan-Ohio State winner next Sunday.
It certainly seems that a spot in the national title game is now USC's to lose. The big question is whether Notre Dame is in the same boat. If the Irish go to Los Angeles and beat USC on Nov. 25, would they finish ahead of a one-loss SEC champion? Given the way voters are influenced by names and tradition, it's hard to imagine them not being in front of Arkansas. Who would get the nod between Notre Dame and Florida is anyone's guess. Either way, a team with a lot of clout would feel jilted by the system, inciting another major BCS controversy and even more cries for a playoff.
Although it's certainly not what the fans are looking for, the final three weeks of the season are really starting to take the shape of a playoff bracket. Saturday's Michigan-Ohio State game is essentially a national semifinal, with the winner earning a spot in the championship game. If USC beats Cal on Saturday, the following week's game between Notre Dame and USC could almost be like the other national semi. But if Cal beats USC, and the Trojans then beat the Irish, it's possible that the SEC Championship Game could serve as that other semifinal … if Florida and Arkansas are both there with 11-1 records.
There are fewer scenarios in play after this past weekend's upsets, but there are still plenty of possibilities in the race for the BCS title.
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[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]Twice As Nice[/FONT]
One possibility that seemed unlikely a week ago was a national championship rematch between Ohio State and Michigan. But now that the number of once-beaten teams has dwindled significantly, it's easier to see how it could happen.
Let's start with a classic game on Saturday. If the Buckeyes and Wolverines go down to the wire, there's a chance. Anything less, and voters probably wouldn't allow a rematch to take place.
The next step is finding losses for USC, Florida, Notre Dame and Arkansas. USC would have to beat Notre Dame and fall to either Cal or UCLA. Arkansas could clinch the SEC West by beating Mississippi State, then lose to LSU, then beat Florida in the SEC title game. It's not that far fetched.
If this series of events took place, many people would say, "What about Rutgers?" If the Scarlet Knights are unbeaten at the end of the regular season, it's hard to believe enough voters would rank them ahead of the Michigan-OSU loser unless that game was lopsided. But if Saturday's big game doesn't live up to the hype, and the only other one-loss teams include Louisville, Wisconsin and Wake Forest, then Rutgers just might end up playing for all the marbles.
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]Buckeyes No. 6?[/FONT]
The Michigan and Ohio State collision in Columbus features No. 1 vs. No. 2 in the polls and the BCS. But the Buckeyes and Wolverines are not 1 vs. 2 everywhere. According to the BCS computers -- at least by four of the six ratings -- the No. 2 team in the nation is Rutgers. And only one of the six computers has Ohio State ranked No. 1. Three have the Buckeyes third, and one computer has them sixth!
Here's the reason. If you really look closely, and keep in mind that the computer ratings are not allowed to factor margin of victory, Ohio State's only impressive win this season is at Texas. And with the Longhorns losing again last Saturday, that suddenly isn't as strong as it was before. Most of the computers consider each team's best win (in addition to winning percentage and schedule strength) to help separate teams with similar numbers. Using this method, Rutgers ranks ahead of Ohio State because Louisville (the best team beaten by Rutgers) is considered to be stronger than Texas. But I'm not about to try to explain how the Buckeyes got that one No. 6 ranking.
Jim Tressel might even put that on the bulletin board.
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[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]BCS Bronco Busting[/FONT]
It's not a done deal yet, but Boise State has now reached the top 12 of the BCS Standings, which is where it needs to finish to gain a spot in a major bowl game.
The key word there is "finish." After this past Saturday's scare at San Jose State, you can be sure it will be quite a challenge for BSU to win at Nevada in the final game of the season. But if the Broncos beat the Wolf Pack, their BCS dreams should come true. Even if they get jumped from behind and drop out of the top 12, they have a good chance to finish ahead of the ACC champion, which is all they need to do in order to qualify. Wake Forest, the highest-ranked ACC team, currently sits at No. 16 in the standings.

Brad Edwards is a college football researcher at ESPN. His Road to the BCS appears weekly during the season.
 
Really looks to me like the 3 that control their destiny are OSU-Mich-USC, and maybe ND, Florida, little iffier there. I just don't see the voters voting for the same game again under just about any circumstances, even if they play a "classic". If Florida wins out and ND beats USC, going to be very interesting to see who the voters put against the OSU-Mich winner. My heart says the Irish, my head says Florida. And if USC, ND, and Florida all lose another one ... God, who knows.
 
Stewart20 said:
Fondy

Wisconsin will not be selected for a BCS bowl because of the rule which states that only two teams from the same conference can go to the BCS bowls. Ohio State and Michigan will be picked, so Wisconsin will not be eligible.

Stewart - Could you find that somewhere on an official site for me and link me? I looked and couldn't find it. I know what that was the rule with 8 BCS teams, but with them changing things this year and adding the 5th game, and guaranteeing teams like Boise State in if they're top 12/16, I believe they removed that. I can't find that in any of the new rules though.
 
ok heres my problem with bcs before i start i understand any team can beat any team but ,the better team will usually win 4 out of 5 ,with that said there are some insane people in the country that have NOTRE DAME anywhere near the top 10 teams ,they have played no boby including a average georgia tech team ,at best notre dame is somewhere between 20-25 look at top 25 teams and ull see 80 percent beat nd 4 outta 5 this is imo but i would also love to see nd in championship game only cause i know they would be HUMMILIATTED ON NATIONAL tv and that would be worth letting a fake team get in there rutgers goes if they undefeated ,and for all u nd fans that say they picked schedule 5 yrs ago well then 5 yrs ago they shouldve removeed all miliatary acads from schedule toooooooo much ype in begin of yr is the only reason why there in top 15 PERIOD!!!p.s. im goin mich with the points and ml
 
One thing I know is Texas really blew a huge opportunity. Snead only led the team for one TD when Mccoy went down. That's what they deserve I guess for having to use Mccoy on the sneak on 4th down when they couldn't punch it in from the one three tries before.

Unbelievable. KSU blows.

I think its going to be USC vs tOSU. If USC drops a game we will see a UM/tOSU rematch and hopefully that gets the playoff talk going since not as many outside of the fans of the team will be excited to see a rematch of a game played in the final week of the season.

We need a playoff. BAD.
 
Fondybadger said:
Stewart - Could you find that somewhere on an official site for me and link me? I looked and couldn't find it. I know what that was the rule with 8 BCS teams, but with them changing things this year and adding the 5th game, and guaranteeing teams like Boise State in if they're top 12/16, I believe they removed that. I can't find that in any of the new rules though.

Here is the language copied from the official bcs website:

All teams earning automatic berths must be selected. No more than two teams from any single Conference may play in BCS games in a single year, regardless of whether they are automatic qualifiers or at-large picks.

The link is http://www.bcsfootball.org/bcsfb/eligibility.

That language appears under the rule number 4 of the Team-Selection Procedures section.
 
moneydog said:
ok heres my problem with bcs before i start i understand any team can beat any team but ,the better team will usually win 4 out of 5 ,with that said there are some insane people in the country that have NOTRE DAME anywhere near the top 10 teams ,they have played no boby including a average georgia tech team ,at best notre dame is somewhere between 20-25 look at top 25 teams and ull see 80 percent beat nd 4 outta 5 this is imo but i would also love to see nd in championship game only cause i know they would be HUMMILIATTED ON NATIONAL tv and that would be worth letting a fake team get in there rutgers goes if they undefeated ,and for all u nd fans that say they picked schedule 5 yrs ago well then 5 yrs ago they shouldve removeed all miliatary acads from schedule toooooooo much ype in begin of yr is the only reason why there in top 15 PERIOD!!!p.s. im goin mich with the points and ml

now don't get me wrong. while i am a notre dame fan, i am by no means an nd homer. and valid points about why notre dame IS in fact over rated are fine by me. deficiencies on defense, horrible o-line play..take your pick.

but i can't stand it when people use notre dame's schedule as a case against them. particulary, with the service academies. now, air force and army are sub-medicore teams at best. but navy has been a bowl team for 3(going on 4) straight seasons.

it's made out to be like notre dame is the only school that schedules (what should be) easy win games. if i'm not mistaken, the top 15 teams in the country scheduled national powerhouse schools like...

western carolina
ball st.
utah st.
se. mo st.
la. monroe
e. washington
la. laf
w. illinois
temple
buffalo
sam houston
sacramento st.
portland st.

navy and air force are better than ALL of these schools. and army is as good, if not better.

plus, notre dame will have played the POTENTIAL acc champ, big ten champ, and pac 10 champ. keep in mind i said potential, that could easily change this weekend.
 
I have no problem with notre dame goin if they beat southern cal.. Their schedule will have been just as tough as Ohio St and Michigans.
 
Stewart - thanks for point that out, completely overlooked that. Well then Louisville or a 2 loss SEC team is in the BCS then...
 
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