Week 2 What Are We Learning
- Thread starter VirginiaCavs
- Start date
Just read Tucker is 1 of 7 from over 50 last 2 years. If true I'm shocked. But 55 to 60 yarders pretty common now.
Gandolf
Leader of the Van Buren Boys
Sean Payton's looks have always given me a Lee Harvey Oswald vibe. Now it appears his goal is to kill the Bronco's season. His decision making had a large hand in losing a very winnable game yesterday.
- Late in the 2nd Q, down 7-0 at the Pitt 39, Payton decides to go for it on 4th and 7 rather than kick a very makeable 56 yard FG at ALTITUDE. They fail and set up a short FG for Pittsburgh to get a short field to score a FG before half and make it 10-0.
- On 2nd and 6 at the Pitt 6 they throw have Bo Nix trying to read the secondary rather than run simple one-option plays. Naturally he throws a pick so instead of at least 3 they get zero.
- Down 13-0 with over 10 minutes left in the game, 4th&6 from the Pitt 16, THIS TIME he chooses to kick the FG to turn it from a 2 score game to a.....2 score game.
- Driving late, down 13-3, needing two scores, only 1 timeout left, they pass on taking a early FG at the Pitt 29 with 3 minutes left to run the clock down to the 2 minute warning before finally kicking the FG to make it a one score game. AND THEN, with only one timeout in their pocket, they pass on the onside kick attempt and hand the ball back to Pittsburgh. They don't get it back until there is 10 seconds left. Just terrible clock mismanagement.
- Late in the 2nd Q, down 7-0 at the Pitt 39, Payton decides to go for it on 4th and 7 rather than kick a very makeable 56 yard FG at ALTITUDE. They fail and set up a short FG for Pittsburgh to get a short field to score a FG before half and make it 10-0.
- On 2nd and 6 at the Pitt 6 they throw have Bo Nix trying to read the secondary rather than run simple one-option plays. Naturally he throws a pick so instead of at least 3 they get zero.
- Down 13-0 with over 10 minutes left in the game, 4th&6 from the Pitt 16, THIS TIME he chooses to kick the FG to turn it from a 2 score game to a.....2 score game.
- Driving late, down 13-3, needing two scores, only 1 timeout left, they pass on taking a early FG at the Pitt 29 with 3 minutes left to run the clock down to the 2 minute warning before finally kicking the FG to make it a one score game. AND THEN, with only one timeout in their pocket, they pass on the onside kick attempt and hand the ball back to Pittsburgh. They don't get it back until there is 10 seconds left. Just terrible clock mismanagement.
brewers888
Chicken Little
Good news for Bryce Young was that he was a respectable 18-26. Unfortunately for him those 18 completions were for a total of 84 yards. He is probably the biggest bust all time at the number one spot for a QB.
The thing was this was easy to see coming. It would be one thing if he had size and a big arm but he's way too small and has below average arm strength. Many people were wrong about CJ Stroud including myself mostly because of the lack of success of Ohio State QBs but what did anyone see in Bryce. He seems like a nice guy and would love to see him prove us all wrong but I just don't think he is an NFL QB at all much less a starter.
The thing was this was easy to see coming. It would be one thing if he had size and a big arm but he's way too small and has below average arm strength. Many people were wrong about CJ Stroud including myself mostly because of the lack of success of Ohio State QBs but what did anyone see in Bryce. He seems like a nice guy and would love to see him prove us all wrong but I just don't think he is an NFL QB at all much less a starter.
brewers888
Chicken Little
I've suspected for a long time that Payton was overrated.
How do onsides kicks work now with new format?? Someone asked and I had no idea. I guess you can't so a surprise one anymore.
skanless13
Fly, Eagles, Fly!
I say that because I wonder if that personality trait and behavior will be able to effectively lead an NFL franchise. Let’s not pretend that NFL isn’t an alpha male sport
CPA-hole
Good night, Duke, and sweet dreams!
You have to declare if you are attempting one. Beyond that I don't what has changed on it.
Coverdatspred
Curious About George Costanza‘s Modeling Career
Our yearly reminder or what any given Sunday means.......The dogs barked big time.
Teams I have overvalued:
Jags
Titans
Colts
Ravens
Broncos
Rams
Teams I have undervalued:
Bills
Bucs
Vikings
Saints
Cardinals
Steelers
I said this earlier in the week in the Survivor thread....Many of us including myself were very high on the Saints before last year. Perhaps we were off by a year. After watching the first two weeks I can say with pretty good conviction that the defense is for real and the offense has a lot of weapons. Carr looks great and confident going into year two with the team. This is for real.
The Raiders are exactly who we have seen in the first two weeks. A team learning their identity. Some weeks they will show up and win games they should not have won and some weeks they will show up and lose games they should have won. Maxx is completely capable of taking over a game and wrecking an offense. Minshew is a capable game manager. I wish they never let Jacobs go.
Something is wrong with the Ravens. I can not quite put my finger on it. They seem to have inexplicable game plans. I would say its atrocious coaching but I have a ton of respect for John Harbaugh. Maybe its that they do not quite know what to do with Lamar? Maybe its because they have paid him so much they are afraid to let him do what he needs to do (run more)? Either way they seem to be in tons of trouble to me.
The Vikings....I dont care who you root for, its pretty cool to see Sam Darnold playing well in the NFL. I hope it continues.
The Bengals look to me like they will be fine. Typical slow start to the season and then round into form.
Something I said to a friend yesterday.......A team can make mistakes during the first three quarters vs the Chiefs and live to tell. If you make mistakes in the 4th quarter they simply make you pay. Over and over again. Too much experience and too great of a coaching staff. The Chiefs take full advantage of breaks and mistakes.
Will Levis is going to play himself out of a starting QB job
The Steelers should not let Russ near the field unless injuries happen.
The Rams are in big trouble. Injuries have been very unfortunate early on. Stafford is tough as nails but he needs to be careful.
At what point do questions need to be asked about Sean Payton? So many call this guy a genius and a great coach. How much of it was Brees? Simply idiotic mistake yesterday not at least going for the onsides kick. He just threw in the towel.
I was thinking that last night would be the last time we see the Texans undervalued a bit. I need to dig in to the numbers for week 3 but my gut tells me they are the far superior team to the Vikings.
Teams I have overvalued:
Jags
Titans
Colts
Ravens
Broncos
Rams
Teams I have undervalued:
Bills
Bucs
Vikings
Saints
Cardinals
Steelers
I said this earlier in the week in the Survivor thread....Many of us including myself were very high on the Saints before last year. Perhaps we were off by a year. After watching the first two weeks I can say with pretty good conviction that the defense is for real and the offense has a lot of weapons. Carr looks great and confident going into year two with the team. This is for real.
The Raiders are exactly who we have seen in the first two weeks. A team learning their identity. Some weeks they will show up and win games they should not have won and some weeks they will show up and lose games they should have won. Maxx is completely capable of taking over a game and wrecking an offense. Minshew is a capable game manager. I wish they never let Jacobs go.
Something is wrong with the Ravens. I can not quite put my finger on it. They seem to have inexplicable game plans. I would say its atrocious coaching but I have a ton of respect for John Harbaugh. Maybe its that they do not quite know what to do with Lamar? Maybe its because they have paid him so much they are afraid to let him do what he needs to do (run more)? Either way they seem to be in tons of trouble to me.
The Vikings....I dont care who you root for, its pretty cool to see Sam Darnold playing well in the NFL. I hope it continues.
The Bengals look to me like they will be fine. Typical slow start to the season and then round into form.
Something I said to a friend yesterday.......A team can make mistakes during the first three quarters vs the Chiefs and live to tell. If you make mistakes in the 4th quarter they simply make you pay. Over and over again. Too much experience and too great of a coaching staff. The Chiefs take full advantage of breaks and mistakes.
Will Levis is going to play himself out of a starting QB job
The Steelers should not let Russ near the field unless injuries happen.
The Rams are in big trouble. Injuries have been very unfortunate early on. Stafford is tough as nails but he needs to be careful.
At what point do questions need to be asked about Sean Payton? So many call this guy a genius and a great coach. How much of it was Brees? Simply idiotic mistake yesterday not at least going for the onsides kick. He just threw in the towel.
I was thinking that last night would be the last time we see the Texans undervalued a bit. I need to dig in to the numbers for week 3 but my gut tells me they are the far superior team to the Vikings.
Caught a few beat writers preseason. Consensus was oline lacked talent and unimpressive in camp. Its worth noting niners have what is considered a bad oline outside of Trent Williams too.
What I'm seeing is San fran with more explosiveness. San fran does not have the deep shot of carr nor the deep speed.
And defense might have more talent then San fran. ....
Carr has always gotten a bad rap imo. This team is stacked.
In my mind, Justin Tucker is one of the best, if not the best kicker over the last years, so I thought a 56-yarder would be no problem. But as lvmike32 said 1 of 7 last 50+yards fg. Was not 100% serious about my comment.
Frank Costanza
Co-Inventor of the Man's Bra
On or off the field, or both?
Master of the obvious but Cowboys will never achieve anything until Jerry is below ground and no longer worried as much about his next boxing match as he is about his football team.
twinkie13
In transit, arriving late.
Well said Capo. And CDS right above. Kinda felt like the defense was gonna be good. Dennis Allen is just fucking amazing on that side of the ball. He doesn’t get the credit he deserves unless you really follow the game. It’s talent evaluation especially in defensive backfield is the best in my opinion. Hands down.
The offensive line, the way Penning was getting run out of town….and to see this?! Shocking. We saw it, I mean maybe the beat writers just decided?!
In Carr’s defense he’s had different OC’s a bunch. I still think he is what he is, but he looks comfortable in this version of WC offense. I hope it continues. And I hope I’m wrong about him.
The team got shit on a lot by media and fans. Seems like they’ve all bought in.
I want to see it against Philly. Historically as of late the Saints D hasn’t liked these kinda of offenses with this kinda QB.
2daBank
Voice of Reason
I think Houston is really good, potentially like good enough to give kc a run in the playoffs but they gotta stop kicking so many freaking fgs!! They could have easily blown out colts and bears but they seem to really enjoy letting their guy kick 50 yarders all night! They even kicked that one on 4th and like an inch after they challenged the spot! I couldn’t fucking believe they sent the fg kicker out there. It ain’t costing them games against average teams but when they run up against teams like kc those fg’s gonna get them beat.
2daBank
Voice of Reason
I was so high on saints last year when they got Carr, of course they proceeded to be awful and I couldn’t understand it, now they that team and of course I havnt made shit off it! Lol
2daBank
Voice of Reason
That pretty much means the end doesn’t it? How you come back from that? Maybe 2 teams from now like Baker but that pretty rare and he way smaller than baker! lol
CPA-hole
Good night, Duke, and sweet dreams!
Also I just learned Andy Dalton was still in the league.
2daBank
Voice of Reason
He prob pissed he has to go in and get beat to shit, I’d been totally content holding a clipboard for 3-5 mil a year or whatever he getting!
Coverdatspred
Curious About George Costanza‘s Modeling Career
He doesn’t look anything close to a NFL QB. Looks way in over his head. Canales saved Geno Smiths career and gave us the best version of Baker we have seen. He gave up after two weeks of Bryce. He won’t be in the league much longer.
2daBank
Voice of Reason
Great post.
I honestly dunno how Levis ever got a starting gig to begin with? I been beating this drum since college, he can’t read a defense, has no understanding of throwing to where a wr gonna be not where he sees him, and for a kid who should run more you almost have to call designed runs cause his pocket awareness is zilch! This one team think I was correct to not buy, even the talented wr’s they got all come with a question mark somewhere and I can’t imagine any of them gonna be happy with another month this kid trying to throw them the ball! If they gonna start him at qb they damn sure better start calling some designed qb runs cause that really his best quality plus if they start threatening the edge w him it could open up holes for pollard. That said this kid is not a nfl qb when it comes to pretty much all the things needed, he athletic and has an arm, those really the only 2 boxes he checks. Oh and he does some of the most unbelievably dumb shit you ever seen like twice a game!!
Always thought Darnold got raw deal being stuck going to jets and their redic bad coaching. Now that he been learning w Shanny for a year as backup and with a good coach from that tree with bunch of weapons we seeing who he is. He will still make 1-2 really bad desicions most games but they might be good enough to overcome those! It’s crazy how good the Norris Div could be, for years it was packers and bunch of scrubs, now lions, Vikings, packers (although not sure how long love out? Impressive they won yesterday but they need him), and I think bears will improve as the year goes. Feel like bears might have whiffed with this coaching staff but maybe they will figure things out, I think Williams can play and they have more than enough talent, they have faced some tough defenses to start the year. Anyways who woulda guessed this could be one the best divisions in football?
Rams are decimated, they work those WRs so damn hard it was prob inevitable, you right they gonna get Stafford killed, he a tough SOB! I’m glad he got a SB cause he was so under appreciated in Detroit.
Agree w you bout bungals, I’ve learned in an expensive way not to underestimate Burrow! Ppl just gotta understand they seem to not take camp very serious or guys not there so the 1st month is basically their preseason.
I def had the ravens overrated, I swear it felt like they shoulda been up 20 yesterday yet there they are letting raiders hang around and when things get tight late they don’t make winning plays. Even at their best they were bullies, they didn’t have a lot of down to the wire games. I’m with you, I think Harbaugh an excellent coach but something is def wrong with the offense/play calling, it’s like a constant battle with their own identity and what they want to be. They also did lose quite a bit off the d and oline.
I said the exact same thing bout Steelers and Russ yesterday, if I’m them Russ stays “injured” all year. In a funny way Fields is like the perfect qb for Tomlin and I have a feeling they might not get the same effort from everyone if Russ under center, guys just don’t like him, can’t blame them I don’t know him and I don’t like him!! I damn sure wouldn’t run thru a wall for him, unless it was to avoid talking to him!!
Not sure bout Peyton, I was never a huge Brees fan so I gave Peyton lot of the credit for his success but I coulda been wrong, it happens every now and then, lol. All I know is every week the offense gonna get worse and worse until they prove they can and will push the ball down the field, defenses are gonna start playing way up on these guys and it gonna be very difficult to move the ball the way they trying to run offense.
I got killed over and over last year waiting for saints to look like they are now! I thought they shoulda fired Allen during the freaking season but seems like they just needed a competent OC! They are def for real, the Bucs are no joke either, I’ve ripped baker for years but he actually looks like a legit nfl qb now, he has finally matured it seems and with those 2 studs at wr I think ppl who liked falcons coming into this year are in trouble cause far as I can tell saints and Bucs are several notches better than falcons.
I def had the cards undervalued, Murray looks like that dude again, he throws such a pretty ball and nobody, not even Lamar, has the escape ability this kid has, he a fucking magician under pressure and he always keeps his eyes down field looking for the home run before taking off which he can do and get a 1st down pretty much anytime he wants. With all rams injuries, all Niners issues and Cmac out for some time (they were lucky he stayed healthy long as he did), with geno playing qb in Seattle, the cardinals just might be the best team in the nfc west!! I sure didn’t see that coming!
Colts can‘t stop the run. They also let Mixon go off in Week One
2daBank
Voice of Reason
I think a big part of that is their qb is not consistent enough to lead sustained drives so they getting put out on the field a lot. They really need to start getting AR to pick up 1st downs w his feet cause he simply isn’t capable as a pocket passer, sure he will make a few crazy plays but that doesn’t give the d any time to rest, this could become a bigger and bigger problem for them so I’ll def be looking at rb props vs them. I dunno what time of possessions have looked like, I know it felt like Houston had the ball a lot week 1, I assume with all the running Jacobs did pack had a significant top edge?
C-MAN
Pretty much a regular
Wow, I must be in the minority but Caleb Williams was much better than I expected. Yeah, a couple of those back shoulder throws later in the game looked bad, but not sure whose fault that was. And when Houston blitzed he had no time to throw the ball, but he stood in the pocket and took a beating. When Houston did not blitz, he was picking apart their zone in a pretty impressive way. Chicago’s defense was also very good in the second half. If they can improve their offensive line and get the running game going, they could be a dangerous team next year.
Timh
CTG Psychiatrist - Dr. Tim
Ravens OL particularly right side with Faalele and Mekari are not playing up to their usual standards. Ronnie Stanley also has not been the same since the injury and his play has dropped off. I don't really like Lamar in the two minute drill. He gets impatient back there and doesn't go through all his reads before pulling the ball down. Ravens back 7 on D very solid, and with King Henry still very formidable they should be a run first team that will do well in the colder and windy conditions later in the year. Baltimore has not used their backs very well in the passing game, and they really need improvement there along with running an occasional draw play which we hardly ever see. Flowers is evolving nicely as a go to downfield guy, and hopefully Lamar will get his chemistry reinvigorated with Andrews who is coming off the injury. Surprisingly Tucker is in a little slump with the longer kicks and I would expect that to get rectified. They should still be a playoff team, but just not sure Lamar is the guy who can win the big game for them.
Phenomenal post
Colin Wynner
Pretty much a regular
Not defending the decision but their kicker pulled a hammy and was not available.
Maybe sets up an emotional let-down scenario for next week?
Colin Wynner
Pretty much a regular
The Rams are in deep trouble. Kupp out four games, Puka out at least two more. 49ers on deck, a trip to Chicago after and Packers back in LA. 1-4 after looks to be best case. Some of the injuries are unlucky, but I agree with bank, they ride these guys, often across the middle of the field, too much. Lost season and no real future at quarterback.
I was as down on the Bills as anyone this year but that division seems like it’s theirs to lose now. We will see in the next four weeks - Jags at home, then three straight roadies - Ravens, Texans and Jets. Sets up nicely for a play on the visiting Titans against them in week 7, especially if getting double digits.
I think both the Chargers and Steelers are frauds and one on them is going to be 3-0 after this week. Looking to play against them to make the playoffs, but the Chargers have a lot of winnable games on the schedule. I might just grab the Steelers at a plus number “No” if they win this weekend.
I guess the Eagles can afford to blow games given their division is a joke with at least 4 guaranteed wins but the game management at the end was atrocious. That situation is simple, it’s four down territory. That changes the third down call to likely a run, and maybe the 4th down call is the same pass to butter fingers Barkley. Even if he drops it, the Falcons are at the 9, with 52 seconds left, they are 100% playing for a FG and overtime.
And the “brotherly shove” play was getting 1.5-2 yards, they conceivably could have run that twice. Everyone knows it’s coming and the success rate is still 87%.
Going up 6 there only meant the Falcons would have four downs every set and would be aggressive.
I get that the breakdowns by Barkley, the defense and then Hurts could/should have got the win. But as Darrell Royal stated about passing the ball, “Three things can happen, and two of them are bad.” On 4th down that passing play would have been a much better call.
In general, the first 2-3 weeks are really pre-season and we will see wild variance in performance week-to-week. The but low, sell high capping strategy worked well this week, except for the Panthers.
I was as down on the Bills as anyone this year but that division seems like it’s theirs to lose now. We will see in the next four weeks - Jags at home, then three straight roadies - Ravens, Texans and Jets. Sets up nicely for a play on the visiting Titans against them in week 7, especially if getting double digits.
I think both the Chargers and Steelers are frauds and one on them is going to be 3-0 after this week. Looking to play against them to make the playoffs, but the Chargers have a lot of winnable games on the schedule. I might just grab the Steelers at a plus number “No” if they win this weekend.
I guess the Eagles can afford to blow games given their division is a joke with at least 4 guaranteed wins but the game management at the end was atrocious. That situation is simple, it’s four down territory. That changes the third down call to likely a run, and maybe the 4th down call is the same pass to butter fingers Barkley. Even if he drops it, the Falcons are at the 9, with 52 seconds left, they are 100% playing for a FG and overtime.
And the “brotherly shove” play was getting 1.5-2 yards, they conceivably could have run that twice. Everyone knows it’s coming and the success rate is still 87%.
Going up 6 there only meant the Falcons would have four downs every set and would be aggressive.
I get that the breakdowns by Barkley, the defense and then Hurts could/should have got the win. But as Darrell Royal stated about passing the ball, “Three things can happen, and two of them are bad.” On 4th down that passing play would have been a much better call.
In general, the first 2-3 weeks are really pre-season and we will see wild variance in performance week-to-week. The but low, sell high capping strategy worked well this week, except for the Panthers.
What a post.
You really put the situation from last night until perfect wording.
The part I didn't think about is that Falcons approach is different down 3 and 50 ish seconds left.
Just brutal coaching.
Timh
CTG Psychiatrist - Dr. Tim
Great post, especially the Eagles part. I didn't like the game but decided to play a fun little parlay for shits and giggles. I had 9-1 on Bijan rushing ydg over, Barkley Pass Rec Ydg over, Barkley TD anytime, and Eagles ML. Barkley falls down on 1/2 yd line, then drops sure TD pass on 3 and 3 inside 10, and Eagles lose the fucking game. Lmao just terrible beat.
my friend in NYC says their kicker was injured going into the game (they knew he could get hurt) but they still decided not to place the backup PK on the active roster. Says they're going crazy there at Mgt. - only the NYG type thing.
2daBank
Voice of Reason
I question the coaching staff more than Williams, I certainly think there potential on this team, I do think Houston has kinda started making a habit of kicking way to many fgs or they prob coulda blown them out same as at Indy. I agree Williams looked better, he wasn’t just big play hunting he was getting it out quick and on time, he did miss one or 2 throws you gotta make in this league in those spots but fucj it his 2nd game, and you right Houston d was coming at him all night!! I’m not completely out on him or anything, I agree bears should improve as the season goes, my biggest question ie the coaching staff, I thought head coach was a crap hire when they made it and I don’t know the OC? I know the head guy is a complete moron when it comes to challenging things!! That one catch was so obviously a catch right in front his face and this clown throws the challenge flag?? Pisses me off cause slows game down when it clearly was the correct call, and I gotta wonder bout someone competence if he dumb evough to make the challenges I’ve seen him make!!
skanless13
Fly, Eagles, Fly!
Here’s more about what I’m talking about with him. I know you are trying to insinuate that I’m being shallow, narrow minded, or ignorant. But it’s not just me having questions about his ability to lead a franchise
peelpub94
More Guards Than Shawshank
Totally fair. I just watched 5x, I saw a young kid who just got his ass beat, lost a close one, and was probably a little too in the moment to accept some thoughtful advice.
skanless13
Fly, Eagles, Fly!
By itself I agree. But apparently there are reports that this reflects his overall attitude with the team. Almost above coaching. The kid definitely has talent. The question is mentally does he have what it takes.
