NBA the shadiest league in the US?

U

~Utah

CTG Super Moderator
Staff member
Watching more and more of this, Im starting to believe Donaghy.

1.David Stern is playing the game where he is trying to make him look like a complete idiot and desperate. In fact in Stern's interveiw he looked smug. David Stern really pisses me off with his smugness

2. Last year the league got some of the worst ratings it has ever gotten for the NBA Finals. Now we are looking at the two most historical teams in the league are in the finals. This is a team that went from an #8 seed, got away with a highway robbery to get Gasol. While the Celtics get 2 superstars all of a sudden and are the best team in the league?

3. From the outside it looks like Donaghy has all the more reason to lie, but looking at more closely hed be an idiot to lie. You dont lie to the FBI, or they will fuck you, they will fuck you so hard your whole family will twitch.

4. This is something that blows my mind, 5 days ago the NBA and David Stern asked Donaghy for 1 million dollars, WHAT, this sounds crazy to me, it doesnt even make sense to me. This came out of nowhere and they just basically what sounds like blackmail asked him for one million fucking dollars.

5. Just looking at this NBA Finals, have there been any suprises, the refs might as well wear the home team jersey's. Theyve given the Lakers and celtics a ton of unbelievable calls.

This shit is shadier then the Italian soccer league :popcorn:
 
Been saying it for years my friend, been saying it for years. You really notice it as a gambler.
 
of course he is telling the truth. i am 100% positive nba is shady. i personally think even some of the regular season games are rigged by players or coaches, etc.
 
whether it be just for fun or to make money i have seen shit that is not sensical pure and simple
 
AlexGurv1987 said:
Watching more and more of this, Im starting to believe Donaghy.

1.David Stern is playing the game where he is trying to make him look like a complete idiot and desperate. In fact in Stern's interveiw he looked smug. David Stern really pisses me off with his smugness

2. Last year the league got some of the worst ratings it has ever gotten for the NBA Finals. Now we are looking at the two most historical teams in the league are in the finals. This is a team that went from an #8 seed, got away with a highway robbery to get Gasol. While the Celtics get 2 superstars all of a sudden and are the best team in the league?

3. From the outside it looks like Donaghy has all the more reason to lie, but looking at more closely hed be an idiot to lie. You dont lie to the FBI, or they will fuck you, they will fuck you so hard your whole family will twitch.

4. This is something that blows my mind, 5 days ago the NBA and David Stern asked Donaghy for 1 million dollars, WHAT, this sounds crazy to me, it doesnt even make sense to me. This came out of nowhere and they just basically what sounds like blackmail asked him for one million fucking dollars.

5. Just looking at this NBA Finals, have there been any suprises, the refs might as well wear the home team jersey's. Theyve given the Lakers and celtics a ton of unbelievable calls.

This shit is shadier then the Italian soccer league :popcorn:
Click to expand...


I hate conspiracy theories and all . What interests me most is the Van Gundy situation where he was fined 100K for speaking about bias officials . Didnt he say someone came to him with information?

The 1 million part is to cover the costs of the investigation I believe . So basically Stern wants Donaghue to flip the bill which doesnt even sound like much . I would have thought it cost alot more then a million bucks to investigate something like this but again not clear on this.

It's like anything else in life really nothing can be proven beyond a shadow of doubt unless all the refs in this "shady " games come forward and say we were CLEARLY instructed to ref a game a certain way and even if its vehemently denied still it will try to be proven because we love scandals as a culture .. I really dont buy much of what Donaghy says because I think its human nature to want revenge . So in his fall from grace he wants to take the NBA down with him. Thats my opinion sort of like all the rats in baseball . If there was alot of validity I would have expected this come to out sometime sooner . The ref scandal is old news why start this shit now? Maybe the game 2 situation jarred some shit up who knows or gave him leverage with such a story .

Any half intelligent person can weave a plausiable tale up that sounds true . If you understand people and perception , mass mentalities you would know its the best time possible to go public with this type story ? Ya know why ? Because PEOPLE want to believe its true and thats all you need for it to be taken as truth . Which is why its even more shadier it came out after the game 2 complaints . It such an easy sell right now . You mean this guy was sitting on this info for a year ? Stern and the NBA have pissed on him since day 1 of this story . What was the hold up ?

Perfect time to drop a bomb and tarnish the NBA. It's like now we want to believe after the fact that going into Iraq was this vast govt conspiracy because it didnt work out the way we expected it to. So instead of saying maybe it was human nature after being attacked to look for the bad in everything and villainize it so we could justify attacking . We make it sound like a cloak and dagger operation to mislead America . When really the misleading was on a personal basis . When maybe it seemed like attacking our perceived enemies was the rational approach . Things get distorted very easily in life . Intent to decieve is another story IMO. Only seeing one side of arguement because you WANT to believe is a flaw of human nature IMO.

Stern just doesnt seem like the type of guy to cheat . Thats my honest opinion as the NBA went from tape delay to primetime under his watch and probably grew more then any sport.

:shake:
 
It's pretty ridiculous that 77% of those surveyed (currently on espn.com) responded yes when asked -

"Do you believe Tim Donaghy's allegation that two referees conspired to ensure a 2002 playoff series went to seven games?"

The NBA is making the NFL look like that Michael Thompson at the Masters this year.
 
3. From the outside it looks like Donaghy has all the more reason to lie, but looking at more closely hed be an idiot to lie. You dont lie to the FBI, or they will fuck you, they will fuck you so hard your whole family will twitch.

I think you are so wrong here. The longer you string them along the longer you delay the inevitable. You think a guy like that can do 25 years in prison ?? Once your fucked its a whole new mindset and that is avoid JAIL at all costs.

You dont this guy is an idiot ? I believe the whole mess saw him profit like 20 K because he was losing so much in other sports . So he gave a great high paying job up and now faces a long jail sentence as well as probably forfeiting his family because when he had a gambling problem he took the easy way out instead of paying his debts and looking himself in the mirror.

So you doubt someone like this would lie ? Thats all he does whether its to himself , his family or the feds....

Like the above poster says w/o knowing anything concrete alerady 77% believe this guy ......SAD
 
SportsNut said:
I hate conspiracy theories and all . What interests me most is the Van Gundy situation where he was fined 100K for speaking about bias officials . Didnt he say someone came to him with information?

The 1 million part is to cover the costs of the investigation I believe . So basically Stern wants Donaghue to flip the bill which doesnt even sound like much . I would have thought it cost alot more then a million bucks to investigate something like this but again not clear on this.

It's like anything else in life really nothing can be proven beyond a shadow of doubt unless all the refs in this "shady " games come forward and say we were CLEARLY instructed to ref a game a certain way and even if its vehemently denied still it will try to be proven because we love scandals as a culture .. I really dont buy much of what Donaghy says because I think its human nature to want revenge . So in his fall from grace he wants to take the NBA down with him. Thats my opinion sort of like all the rats in baseball . If there was alot of validity I would have expected this come to out sometime sooner . The ref scandal is old news why start this shit now? Maybe the game 2 situation jarred some shit up who knows or gave him leverage with such a story .

Any half intelligent person can weave a plausiable tale up that sounds true . If you understand people and perception , mass mentalities you would know its the best time possible to go public with this type story ? Ya know why ? Because PEOPLE want to believe its true and thats all you need for it to be taken as truth . Which is why its even more shadier it came out after the game 2 complaints . It such an easy sell right now . You mean this guy was sitting on this info for a year ? Stern and the NBA have pissed on him since day 1 of this story . What was the hold up ?

Perfect time to drop a bomb and tarnish the NBA. It's like now we want to believe after the fact that going into Iraq was this vast govt conspiracy because it didnt work out the way we expected it to. So instead of saying maybe it was human nature after being attacked to look for the bad in everything and villainize it so we could justify attacking . We make it sound like a cloak and dagger operation to mislead America . When really the misleading was on a personal basis . When maybe it seemed like attacking our perceived enemies was the rational approach . Things get distorted very easily in life . Intent to decieve is another story IMO. Only seeing one side of arguement because you WANT to believe is a flaw of human nature IMO.

Stern just doesnt seem like the type of guy to cheat . Thats my honest opinion as the NBA went from tape delay to primetime under his watch and probably grew more then any sport.

:shake:
Click to expand...

No I actually dont think Stern would have had anything to do with it. I think that the official would if it had happened. Ive got no idea how much these guys get paid either. The 1 million isnt to cover the cost of the investigation, I dont know where you got that from but its for restitution. It turns out that Donaghy filed this paperwork last year, so the whole drop the bomb on the NBA doesnt make sense either. The NBA has known about this allegation for a while, they should have put an investigation into it (im sure any day now that its public they will). They didnt even interveiw the other ref's just to clarify. Nothing came of it. I dont follow much of these conspiricies theories either to be honest. Ive never been one to cry fix when I lose a game or something is shady in a situation. This whole Donaghy thing blew me away to be honest, Ive never even really thought about it being realistic in pro sports in America.
 
While I hate conspircay theories I am at least open minded enough to listen to what is said about the situation. Do I think this is absolutely false ? No , because that would be narrow minded of me . I prefer to look at what type motive he has to make such accusations before I decide anything .

Right now IMO what comes out of this guys mouth is hard to believe its just to coicidental this story came out when it did IMO
 
SportsNut said:
3. From the outside it looks like Donaghy has all the more reason to lie, but looking at more closely hed be an idiot to lie. You dont lie to the FBI, or they will fuck you, they will fuck you so hard your whole family will twitch.

I think you are so wrong here. The longer you string them along the longer you delay the inevitable. You think a guy like that can do 25 years in prison ?? Once your fucked its a whole new mindset and that is avoid JAIL at all costs.

You dont this guy is an idiot ? I believe the whole mess saw him profit like 20 K because he was losing so much in other sports . So he gave a great high paying job up and now faces a long jail sentence as well as probably forfeiting his family because when he had a gambling problem he took the easy way out instead of paying his debts and looking himself in the mirror.

So you doubt someone like this would lie ? Thats all he does whether its to himself , his family or the feds....

Like the above poster says w/o knowing anything concrete alerady 77% believe this guy ......SAD
Click to expand...

Why would this delay anything, hes already guilty and the sentence trail is on July the 14th, its not delaying a thing, and I said in my post earlier, his lawyers filed this report last year to the FBI. Your right that people have a whole new way of thinking when they are fucked as bad as this guy is, but thats why we have lawyers, and im sure he is being for pretty good ones.

Why WOULDNT 77% of the people believe it, where is the evidence that isnt true. I know youve disputed the whole foul call thing in the Finals so far but there has been a huge diffrence in every situation. Your telling me that home and road really affects how aggresive you are? Even ESPN has talked about this, when its something they wouldnt usually completely avoid. If you look at the Game 6 of Sacramento- LA series, even then people said what the fuck just happened here. Im not saying that he even is telling the truth, im not 100 %sure, but this league is getting so shady its stupid. I think America needs to take a good hard look at reality, the soccer players in Europe are always involved in these gambling cases, and they are getting paid no less then the NBA players here, if not more. Do we americans think we are completely untouchable from these type of things? I dont think so.
 
Well the courts chose to release the papers I believe, I dont think the lawyers released them, but I might be wrong (talking about you saying the peculiar timing)
 
Restitution : The act of making good or compensating for loss, damage, or injury; indemnification.

The NBA wants to be compenstated for the money spent on investgating him.

And Alex I just replied to your post certainly nothing personal on my end . Just was going at some points . Not that I took anything you said personal either just to clarify its not me vs you . It certainly is an attention grabbing story . Not sure what to make of the whole when he filed the claim issue because I have to check on that myself . Still if he filed this a year ago how does no one get wind of it ? Everything gets leaked today I thought . Why would his lawyer never even hint at it ? I cant see why this would be a silent issue for a good year if it was so spectular in nature . Can you?
 
SportsNut said:
Stern just doesnt seem like the type of guy to cheat . Thats my honest opinion as the NBA went from tape delay to primetime under his watch and probably grew more then any sport.
Click to expand...
thats a great post, but i think stern is/looks like one of the shadiest guys ever. he makes selig & look moral. i doubt the refs have been biased in this series but i havent watched all the games. i don't think there are fixes in any other sport except nba. it seems logical with the some of the people that play in the nba.
 
SportsNut said:
Restitution : The act of making good or compensating for loss, damage, or injury; indemnification.

The NBA wants to be compenstated for the money spent on investgating him.

And Alex I just replied to your post certainly nothing personal on my end . Just was going at some points . Not that I took anything you said personal either just to clarify its not me vs you . It certainly is an attention grabbing story . Not sure what to make of the whole when he filed the claim issue because I have to check on that myself . Still if he filed this a year ago how does no one get wind of it ? Everything gets leaked today I thought . Why would his lawyer never even hint at it ? I cant see why this would be a silent issue for a good year if it was so spectular in nature . Can you?
Click to expand...

Nothing personal at all, just a friendly debate. Im really not sure. Really, I try not to listen ESPN, actually I usually try to think of everything opposite of ESPN, but this Lester Munson guy on ESPN seems to know what the hells hes talking about. He pointed out that the whole 1 million dollar thing doesnt even make sense and when you think about it, it doesnt. Im sure that a million dollars is a lot of money to Donaghy, but its not that much to NBA< actually, im sure its pretty much almost nothing to the NBA. Do you really think the NBA needs another million dollars, do you really think the NBA needs to file a suit to get a million dollars, whats the point?

I have no idea why the papers on this came out, I guess your probably right its to drop the bomb on the NBA, and obviously it infact has dropped on the NBA, because 77% believe it to be true, with all 50 state winning majority
 
i have a ?: how many nba players (%) do you think check spreads and o/u on a nightly basis? basically having knowledge of the spread?
 
lets say a team is +14, do you think the coach would ever say alright lets just cover this fucking spread.
 
jimbo1227 said:
i have a ?: how many nba players (%) do you think check spreads and o/u on a nightly basis? basically having knowledge of the spread?
Click to expand...

A lot know about spreads im sure, its in the paper everyday, they talk about it on ESPN for the bigger games
 
i dont know how much donaghy has to gain from saying all this shit, but i think he's fucked either way. and i think everybody has just been waiting for the bubble to burst about the rigged nba. i love how the players call the nba a product? nba is shade as they get.
 
AlexGurv1987 said:
Why would this delay anything, hes already guilty and the sentence trail is on July the 14th, its not delaying a thing, and I said in my post earlier, his lawyers filed this report last year to the FBI. Your right that people have a whole new way of thinking when they are fucked as bad as this guy is, but thats why we have lawyers, and im sure he is being for pretty good ones.

Why WOULDNT 77% of the people believe it, where is the evidence that isnt true. I know youve disputed the whole foul call thing in the Finals so far but there has been a huge diffrence in every situation. Your telling me that home and road really affects how aggresive you are? Even ESPN has talked about this, when its something they wouldnt usually completely avoid. If you look at the Game 6 of Sacramento- LA series, even then people said what the fuck just happened here. Im not saying that he even is telling the truth, im not 100 %sure, but this league is getting so shady its stupid. I think America needs to take a good hard look at reality, the soccer players in Europe are always involved in these gambling cases, and they are getting paid no less then the NBA players here, if not more. Do we americans think we are completely untouchable from these type of things? I dont think so.
Click to expand...


What I am saying in terms of delay this . Maybe in his mind he believes if he delivers something of a spectular nature it will help his case . Guy is looking for a break anyway he can get it . Thats what desperation is . It may not seem logical to you or me but we dont have the desperate mentality . Its why murders get caught , why criminals get busted , etc. Your mind thinks differently when its desperate and unhealthy . You lose clarity .

Lawyers arent corrupt ? They have one goal its to help there client out ? You make it sound as if because they are lawyers they are doing the right thing when all they are doing what is best for the client . I am bit confused on this. Like I said not sure about the whole when it was filed issue . I dont deny what you are saying but I just have researched it myself.

Thats my whole point about truth ? Anyone can spin a plausiable tale . Cause it sounds true it is true ? What happened to consider the source? The source is a disgraced ref whose life has fallen apart and is awaiting sentence . So why would you give him the benefit of the doubt over the NBA ? Simple because people who respond YES want to believe.

Of course the possibility of fixing is there and things of that nature . Still even a ref can only do so much .He can give a team an extra 20 FTs but what happens if they dont make them? he could allow somethings to slide but there are to many intangibles such as players and other refs.

If people cant understand the benefit of home and away . Look at every player in the NBA and every player in MLB and go done each players stats and ask yourself why is there such varying degrees of statistics. Why do hitters hit .250 on the road and 310 at home ? Why do pitchers have 3 ERA's at home and 5.50 on the road ? There has to be a benefit to being home even if we cant put it into words .

Just take it very simply. You yourself play basketball everyday at this one gym . One day you decide to go play at another gym . Same mission play basketball but its a totally different atmosphere . Different backboard , Different rim , different court surface , different depth behind the hoop . All stadiums in baseball are different as are all arenas . So why would you be more aggressive at home in a comfortable setting . Do people act the same when they host a party as compared to going to a party where they are a guest and dont know anyone? Comfort is huge !!

You have solid thoughts on the subject but there still are rationale explanations why things occur . I still dont understand why people question the fact home teams get more calls . In fact its pretty logical in the playoffs the home teams will get more calls because of the atmosphere.....

:shake:
 
you are starting to convince me that donaghy is making up some shit but i still believe that there are numerous rigged games in an nba year whether it be by players, refs, coaches, stern. i dont fuckin know.
 
a recent study has shown that about 1% of the NCAAB games were fixed so it's not surprising to see some NBA games fixed.
moreover believe me or not, but NBA coaches and players know the spread in nearly every game they play and i think they are interested to beat it for their fan backers
How could we explain the 3 point shot of sasha vujacic vs the spurs in the PO where they were up by 5 and guaranteed to win? for the pleasure of improving his stats , NO!!! It's for cashing tickets for their fans that took the lakers at -7,5!!!!
 
I dont htink any of us know until we have more facts, maybe by July 14th more will come out. I dont like how stern has handled this. One thing I know for sure, the league is pretty shady. Not shady like Indian cricket, but shady
 
SN, if you watched that interview with stern just a couple days ago he was THE most nervous man i have ever seen.
 
i say fuck it lets just totally rig the nba wwf style, and you can bet on it, and hopefully you are on the right side of the fix.
 
What coach wouldnt start the pregame pep talk with "guys they got us listed in Vegas as 14 point underdogs. Do we suck that bad?
Does this team really deserve to beat us by 14 on any given night?
Lets get out there and play our hearts out and for shits sake lets keep it under double digits(alright hands in)......one....two....three......COVER"
 
AlexGurv1987 said:
Nothing personal at all, just a friendly debate. Im really not sure. Really, I try not to listen ESPN, actually I usually try to think of everything opposite of ESPN, but this Lester Munson guy on ESPN seems to know what the hells hes talking about. He pointed out that the whole 1 million dollar thing doesnt even make sense and when you think about it, it doesnt. Im sure that a million dollars is a lot of money to Donaghy, but its not that much to NBA< actually, im sure its pretty much almost nothing to the NBA. Do you really think the NBA needs another million dollars, do you really think the NBA needs to file a suit to get a million dollars, whats the point?

I have no idea why the papers on this came out, I guess your probably right its to drop the bomb on the NBA, and obviously it infact has dropped on the NBA, because 77% believe it to be true, with all 50 state winning majority
Click to expand...

Again thats the trick even if ESPN doesnt intend to spin it right now human nature wants to believe this is happening to justify the emotions of ths series towards the ref . So they are fueling the fire because thats what the media does. If you want to "prove" something you want to get the guy who seems to be the one who sells it best . If you want to discredit someone you bring in the guy easiest to discredit and hype him up.

The 1 million thing clearly is the NBA being petty. They are trying to hurt him everyway possible. Which is why I wonder was the intent of asking only for a million because its not as likely to getquickly dismissed? If they asked for say 20 million it might get thrown out of court in 10 seconds the lesser sum do they have a more realistic chances of getting anything from him. Definetly a spite issue IMO ...nothing more...

Its like the newscaster Dan Rather its pretty clear he didnt like George Bush . So when he came across something that could deliver a negative blow he rushed to judgement . Did he purposely intend to pass false information off as truth ? I doubt it. He simply wanted so bad to believe it was true he accepted it as truth before investigating it. Which is my point on this topic . People IMO and I could be wrong I am nobody simply want to believe there is collusion and fixing to justify there emotions and outrage . :shake:
 
i've always thought that P & G. i think a coach would be like alright i dropped 500 on us tonight, you mother fuckers better cover.
 
i think if stern didnt pull a few strings the nba would not have progressed as well or as fast.
 
he just wanted the lakers in the finals. he made a simple call to a ref and said this series better go to game 7 if you know what i mean. then that ref told his buddies and they got down w/ shady business.
 
they keep nba refs around forever because they are the best at fixing games. and i mean come on, do you trust half these characters that play in the nba?
 
he had to get KG and allen rings so he put em on the same team to kill two birds w/ one stone.
 
dick bavetta is the richest mother fucker this side of the mississippi because he has been fixing games for 50+ years.
 
edou1x said:
a recent study has shown that about 1% of the NCAAB games were fixed so it's not surprising to see some NBA games fixed.
moreover believe me or not, but NBA coaches and players know the spread in nearly every game they play and i think they are interested to beat it for their fan backers
How could we explain the 3 point shot of sasha vujacic vs the spurs in the PO where they were up by 5 and guaranteed to win? for the pleasure of improving his stats , NO!!! It's for cashing tickets for their fans that took the lakers at -7,5!!!!
Click to expand...


I so agree here bro. Thats the point by simplying having the ability to bet on sports outcomes are effected. Dont we see many major NCAAF coaches run up scores and try hard to cover point spreads to satisfy boosters and fans? I think we are ignorant in that manner and by that I mean as a society .

How can you not know the spread of a game ? Especially in the NFL and NBA . We are curious by nature if I am flipping through the paper chances are I am going to want to see what the spread is and I mean as an athlete .

So exactly my point sports are already directly effected by simly having lines on them . I think every player would want to cover his respective spread whether fav or dog . While players dont admit to moral victories if a NFL team comes into DALLAS as 14 pt dogs and plays a great game losing by a FG in OT well that spread in a way help measured how well they played .

The Sasha point is well taken but I dont think I completely agree . Covering a spread could have meant alot of why he shoot it but also sports are emotional . Anytime you score a hoop its a quick burst of adrenaline or excitement . It feels good for Sasha to hit that shot more then pad his stats. How hard is to teach kids to hold the ball at the end of a basketball game ?? HUman nature tells us shoot it score one more time...get that rush...especially if you are home and the crowd is cheering loudly.....

The absolute term in the description is where I have a problem as well. Lets say your 100% right one and only reason Sasha was it because he wanted to cover the number . Okay so what happens if he missed ? Really its not even a 50-50 proposition so if he misses then didnt he just exactly the opposite of what he intended . Thats why I think we carried away with signaling out every play that doesnt make sense. Sure can it happen , does it happen no doubt but at such a lower rate then we seem to say it does...even you said 1% in NCAAB thats the easiest sport to fix so if its 0.5% in the NBA what are talking once every 200 games ? Which would be 10-12 times a year .....what if the number was 0.25 % the 5 times it may happen a year out of 2500 occurrences ?

:shake:
 
if donaghy is lying he is so fucked, so he might be telling the truth. ever since ive bet the nba i knew it was shady but i had no way of explaining it. hopefully i get some answers. =|
 
jimbo1227 said:
if donaghy is lying he is so fucked, so he might be telling the truth. ever since ive bet the nba i knew it was shady but i had no way of explaining it. hopefully i get some answers. =|
Click to expand...

Well I am not denying there are odd things but to say they are fixed is another . To me its odd LAL is -5.5 and covers the 1st Half by 6 . To me -5 is fairly aggressive for a 9 spread let alone -5.5....and it sneaks by 6 at half.....

Like I said IMHO Donaghy is not capable of doing 25 years in prison he probably couldnt do 25 months so the point is in his mind right now what does he have to lose . He is done , his life is over . Being this is a case that sort of sets precedent he will get a stiff sentence IMO.

Actually just heard him on ESPN briefly and he said he feels Donaghy is doing this to get a lighter sentence and then sort of went into the cross checking system refs have . As I mentioned video tape delay to #1 sport in America IMO. On the heels of this scandal wouldnt you expect this the time for the NBA to be on the up and up. One would expect this is when they are look at closest . Which I am speaking about in terms of this series and the officiating .

Have to go its time to finish MLB......later fellas !:shake:
 
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