Is Quinn on his way in? Browns mull quarterback changes

[G-Man]

I cant see the Browns going 0-2 against their division rivals without a shot at winning this one. I'll be on Cleveland if the kid plays, or even if he's moved up to the number 2 spot. Bungles have just come off a Monday nighter against a rough Baltimore team. Traveling to Cleveland, is going to be hard for Cincy to win this one. I like Clevelands chances pending the QB situation.

Heres the story,

Is Quinn on his way in? Browns mull quarterback changes following Pittsburgh debacle
By TOM WITHERS, AP Sports Writer
September 10, 2007

AP - Sep 10, 4:57 pm EDT
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BEREA, Ohio (AP) -- For one of the rare times in his football life, Brady Quinn was a game-day spectator. Instead of a helmet, he wore a brown-and-orange baseball cap. He carried a clipboard.

Quinn stood on the sideline and watched, maybe for one of the last times.

Tagged since April's draft as Cleveland's quarterback of the future, Quinn could soon become the Browns' man of the moment.

In the aftermath of a 34-7 drubbing against Pittsburgh in Sunday's season opener, Cleveland coach Romeo Crennel didn't rule out Quinn making his NFL debut this week against Cincinnati.

Quinn served as Cleveland's emergency quarterback on Sunday, but after both starter Charlie Frye and backup Derek Anderson failed miserably against the Steelers, the Browns may soon turn to their high-profile rookie from Notre Dame.

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Is Quinn ready?

"You'll have to ask Brady that," said tight end Steve Heiden, one of the Browns' co-captains. "But from what I've seen, I think he is."

Quinn's readiness is at the heart of an internal debate raging inside Cleveland's team headquarters.

The Browns don't want to rush the 22-year-old Quinn into the starting lineup. But after seeing both Frye and Anderson throw interceptions, force passes into tight coverage, and in Frye's case, hold the ball too long, the club may have no other choice.

Quinn missed 16 practices during a holdout in training camp, and the Browns might feel he hasn't taken enough practice snaps to effectively run their offense against a rugged early schedule that includes Pittsburgh, Oakland, Baltimore and New England -- all top 10 defenses last season.

The Browns' preference would be for Quinn to sit and learn for as long as possible. That's the short-term plan. What remains to be seen is how long Crennel and general manager Phil Savage stick with it if Frye and/or Anderson continue to struggle.

During his news conference on Monday, Crennel said he would not discuss any possible personnel moves with the media until he had spoken to his players following an afternoon film session and meeting.

Pressed by reporters on whether he felt Quinn was ready for the Bengals, Crennel, who dropped to 1-12 against AFC North teams, became annoyed with the line of questioning.

"For me to make a comment on where I think Brady is or where he is on the depth chart, that's making a personnel decision," Crennel said, "so I'm not going to do that."

Crennel did say Quinn would be part of any conversation about the quarterback situation, which became more muddled Monday when Ken Dorsey, released by the team on Sept. 1, was at the team's training facility.

Dorsey served as a mentor for Quinn during training camp, and his return could add credence to the Browns getting Quinn ready for the Bengals.

Crennel has been firm on not wanting to accelerate Quinn's growth track. And despite the lopsided loss -- Cleveland's eighth straight to the Steelers -- he hasn't changed his stance. Crennel felt throwing Quinn into Sunday's debacle in the fourth quarter would have done the rookie more harm than good.

Frye didn't have such protection.

After winning an open competition during the preseason over Anderson, Frye was yanked by Crennel with 6:34 remaining in the second quarter. By then, he had gone 4-of-10 for 34 yards, thrown a horrible interception and been sacked five times.

If that wasn't bad enough, some Cleveland fans booed Frye, while others chanted "Bra-dy," "Bra-dy."

Crennel's quick hook of Frye could indicate the coach's lack of confidence in the third-year veteran, just 6-13 as a starter. Crennel felt the move was his only option in a game that was quickly slipping away.

"If you don't pull him your team might say: 'The coach is not doing enough to win, or to try to win,"' Crennel said. "I think that Charlie didn't play his best game and he would say that he needs to improve. I don't think that he holds it against me for taking him out when I did. I was just trying to do what I thought was best for the team. That's what a coach has to do."

Anderson was only slightly better than Frye.

He went 13-of-28 for 184 yards and produced Cleveland's only touchdown. While he may have a stronger arm than Frye or Quinn, Anderson has a tendency to make poor decisions with the ball.

But Anderson, who made three starts last season, remains a safe option if the Browns want to wait on Quinn.

Either way, Cleveland's quarterback drama drags on.

Heiden said that if Crennel decides to make a switch, he'll have the backing of everyone in Cleveland's locker room.

"Whoever he says is the guy, is the guy," he said. "I think we're all on the same page and we all want the best person to play. You could ask 53 guys in this locker room and they'll all say the same thing.

"We all just want to win and the quarterbacks would say the same."

 

[rolub]

In no way, shape, or form can I back this team following what I saw on Sunday.

 

[rolub]

FWIW, local radio is now reporting that the Browns are attempting to trade Frye to make a spot for Dorsey on the roster. If no trade is worked out, he'll be flat-out cut.

I see no reason to keep Brady off the field. This is a completely different situation than Couch was involved with in '99.

 

[frankiegotti]

rolub...don't give up love on the browns... if we look on the bright side at least the indians and cavs are contenders.

I don't think the browns are that bad and i don't think the steelers are that good. It just so happened that there was a series of plays that made the steelers up 17-0.

An Interception almost in the red zone, a punt that goes 15 yards once again almost in the red zone, and brodney pool misreads his coverage assignment.

So, from that point on it was basically playing catchup.

Quinn should go in week 6 or 8. I say either or because week 6 they play at home against miami and week 8 they play at st. louis and week 7 is their bye week. Typically, first time starts on the road go really bad so the browns organization may want to consider starting at home the week before the bye week giving them ample time to review his performance and let him bite off more of a peice of the play book so to speak.

 

[rolub]

Whoops, let me clarify... I am a HUGE Browns fan, and always will be.

I made a poor choice of words when i said "In no way, shape, or form can I back this team following what I saw on Sunday." I was only referring to backing them as in betting on them, as G-man referred to should Quinn start.

The Indians are number 1A and the Browns are 1B with me. Thankfully, the A option has realistic chances this year.

:cheers:

 

[Joe Public]

I see no reason to keep Brady off the field.

I can. I saw six of them on Sunday. Then I saw Cincy create six turnovers last night.

What possible good comes from putting Brady into a situation like that?

They probably should have cut Anderson rather than Frye, but now, if they want to bring Dorsey back, which I've seen talk of, too, they need to do something.

Cutting Frye, I think, would be a mistake, if only because he's the only one other than Quinn of those three (DA, Dorsey, and Frye) that I think can potentially win you a game.

Starting DA is raising the white flag until Quinn comes in, so is starting Dorsey. What the team should do is circle the wagons, say everybody has a bad game, and tread water with Frye until the bye week, then look to get Quinn in.

Let's stop pretending the Browns were going to have a winning season, we all knew they wouldn't when we saw the schedule and if the Ravens can do what they did to Cincy's offense last night, in Week One, what will they do to a rookie QB in Week Three.

I understand the game was bad, it was the worst loss since, well, probably since the Browns return when Pittsburgh crushed them. But putting Quinn back there behind a line that has yet to learn how to block for any QB, with the Ravens, Raiders, Patriots, and Dolphins upcoming is just stupid and would simply be this staff trying to save its job.

Oh, and we'd still be 0-5.

 

[JumpOnBoard]

Frye is gone to SEA..

 

[rolub]

What possible good comes from putting Brady into a situation like that?

Seriously, how can it get worse?

I'm sick and tired of

A) people comparing this situation to Couch in '99... this isn't an expansion team we have here. Plus, Frye can take the blame for all but one of those sacks. From holding the ball too long to not seeing a man rush you in your plain sight, he made mistakes that the average NFL QB cannot make.

and

B) pretending that Brady Quinn is a homeschooled Quaker about to be thrown into the Orange County's social scene. For every Tim Couch you throw at me, I'll give you the Peyton Manning that took his 1-15 lumps as a rookie, getting sacked mercilessly, and turned out to be fine in the coming years. No, I'm not saying he's Peyton Manning, but it's ridiculous to think you need to baby a 22-year old man who started 3 years at Notre Dame.

No, they're not going to go to the playoffs this year. That doesn't even need to be said. But how is Quinn's learning curve advanced by watching D.A. throw behind Winslow 4 times a game?

 

[frankiegotti]

joe at least you have my point of view...

I really don't want whatever confidence he has being shot down the shitter.

 

[Joe Public]

Seriously, how can it get worse?

Injury.

Or just look at David Carr.

What good comes from putting a guy back there to simply get pounded on every week.

This O-line is not ready yet. Why on earth would you subject Quinn to the f**king Ravens and the Pats when you don't have to?

I'm not worried about him getting bored watching DA throw high and wide to, well, everybody. I'm worried about this guy getting his head taken off while the line comes together.

 

[cappingbob]

I think Brady will be better than both of them bums on sunday. If you watched the game there was only 1 sack that should have happened when Frye was in there. The other 5 were all Fryes fault. The guy just refuses to stay in the pocket. That is why they call it a pocket for the quarterback to stand in there and throw from there. I am a die hard Browns fan but they are just so damn hard to watch. They frustrate the hell out of me.:smiley_acbe:

 

[Joe Public]

Bye bye, Charlie. I'm not sure what you did, but you p*ssed somebody off well and good.

Frye to Seattle, Dorsey back to Cleveland.

It says a sixth rounder, but I think we must have got a case of a microbrew, too.

 

[rolub]

Bye bye, Charlie. I'm not sure what you did,

I'm not sure either.

Which is pretty damning when you're a team's starting QB.

 

[Joe Public]

Yeah, but Frye is really just the scapegoat here.

I agree with Grossi from the PD, if you prepare for five months for a team and this is the effort that you get, this is a team thing. This is an organizational thing.

I really think this was the job that cost Romeo his job.

 

[G-Man]

I bought 1 point here.


Sep 11 3:22pm Football - Pending 500.00 to win 400.00
1. Football - Cleveland Browns - spread +7½ (-125)
for the entire game held on Sep 16 at 12:00pm [pending]

I'll post this in my Sunday thread, but wanted to say during this thread that Cleveland WILL be inside this number. Quinn will likely play. Anderson may do well too.

Cleveland's "D: is far better than most know. Week 2 will help Cleveland here.

Thanks for trading Frye. At least we didnt wait until we were 0-4.

 

[G-Man]

Yeah, but Frye is really just the scapegoat here.

I agree with Grossi from the PD, if you prepare for five months for a team and this is the effort that you get, this is a team thing. This is an organizational thing.

I really think this was the job that cost Romeo his job.

Joe, Grossi is a total idiot. Dont ever listen to THAT guy. He's taking political speech lessons from Romeo...

Quinn and sacks have noting to do with the ability of throwing and hitting a target. Frye couldnt hit them when he wasnt sacked. And he was real slow in making decisions. Thats how he got sacked 5 times.

Quinn has a similar Marino quickness, and similar Montana accuracy.. Let the kid in there and we'll see if he can handle the pressure. The "O-line" will give the kid enough time. He'll be at least a 61-63% passer. Something no other qb was for cleveland.

 

[STEED]

nope

 

[Wikeman]

What possible good comes from putting Brady into a situation like that?

Seriously, how can it get worse?

I'm sick and tired of

A) people comparing this situation to Couch in '99... this isn't an expansion team we have here. Plus, Frye can take the blame for all but one of those sacks. From holding the ball too long to not seeing a man rush you in your plain sight, he made mistakes that the average NFL QB cannot make.

and

B) pretending that Brady Quinn is a homeschooled Quaker about to be thrown into the Orange County's social scene. For every Tim Couch you throw at me, I'll give you the Peyton Manning that took his 1-15 lumps as a rookie, getting sacked mercilessly, and turned out to be fine in the coming years. No, I'm not saying he's Peyton Manning, but it's ridiculous to think you need to baby a 22-year old man who started 3 years at Notre Dame.

No, they're not going to go to the playoffs this year. That doesn't even need to be said. But how is Quinn's learning curve advanced by watching D.A. throw behind Winslow 4 times a game?

Amen to that.

 

[Joe Public]

Guys, seriously, I don't understand why you would think Quinn would start at this point.

Notice I didn't say I don't understand why you would 'want' him to start. That I get. Even I'd like that in some ways, but it's just not very smart.

Again, how can it get any worse, well, it could be Quinn in there losing by 40 every week, getting his head knocked off, and I'm sorry, but not everybody is Peyton Manning. Not everybody can just shake that off, in fact, most guys can't. Hell, his brother doesn't even look like he can shake off the losses.

I want the Browns to win as much as anybody, more than most, actually, but for the long-term health of this team I don't see what putting him in there right now does other than needlessly subjecting him to punishment.

It's not as if the guy was in camp on time, it's not as if he has full command of the playbook (not that this helped Frye keep his spot on the roster, let alone in the lineup), but if you know the season is lost, which we all know, why not bring him along slowly?

Bring him in when he's mopping up second halves at first, then in a few weeks start him when the line has jelled and he's comfortable with everything he's doing.

Again, I think the guy's got a lot of potential, but playing against the Lions' third string defense and the Broncos' second string defense is a world away from playing the Ravens' starting defense.

 

[Joe Public]

Oh, and for the record, I think the Browns start DA on Sunday and that they should lose by 14.

However, if they're down big enough, early enough, you might see some of Quinn in the second half. Maybe. And in that case who knows what could happen, a backdoor might even be possible.

 

[EDizzle]

This is just bizzare! What kind of shitty ass franchise would trade their STARTING QB for the first game 2 days after the season started!!!!! It doesnt make ANY sense. The only sense I can make of this is that the brownstains are a MESS.

 

[G-Man]

This is just bizzare! What kind of shitty ass franchise would trade their STARTING QB for the first game 2 days after the season started!!!!! It doesnt make ANY sense. The only sense I can make of this is that the brownstains are a MESS.

Answer: The kind that KNOWS the QB is shittier than what's on the bench.

 

[Joe Public]

This organization is in free-fall, that's the bottom line.

It's all the more reason I want the storm to pass some before it punishes some of the guys who will out-last it (Brady Quinn, Joe Thomas, etc.)

 

[G-Man]

Guys, seriously, I don't understand why you would think Quinn would start at this point.

Notice I didn't say I don't understand why you would 'want' him to start. That I get. Even I'd like that in some ways, but it's just not very smart.

Again, how can it get any worse, well, it could be Quinn in there losing by 40 every week, getting his head knocked off, and I'm sorry, but not everybody is Peyton Manning. Not everybody can just shake that off, in fact, most guys can't. Hell, his brother doesn't even look like he can shake off the losses.

I want the Browns to win as much as anybody, more than most, actually, but for the long-term health of this team I don't see what putting him in there right now does other than needlessly subjecting him to punishment.

It's not as if the guy was in camp on time, it's not as if he has full command of the playbook (not that this helped Frye keep his spot on the roster, let alone in the lineup), but if you know the season is lost, which we all know, why not bring him along slowly?

Bring him in when he's mopping up second halves at first, then in a few weeks start him when the line has jelled and he's comfortable with everything he's doing.

Again, I think the guy's got a lot of potential, but playing against the Lions' third string defense and the Broncos' second string defense is a world away from playing the Ravens' starting defense.

Part of wwhat you quoted here is inaccurate. He drove downfield against Denvers first string defense. It was reported today by the media here.
Joe, There is a much bigger issue here than "throwing Quinn to the dogs. All 53 players believed he can change the outcome. Savage said thats why Frye was traded. he did it because the whole roster was for the kid to play. DA has about three full series to show something on Sunday. If he doesnt, and the Bengals start taking over the game, "Quinn will be IN!"

I know you have had to see this kid in the preseason games on TV. He is very very accurate. We all know now just how bad the whole Notre Dame team was talent-wise. He's gone and they suck. He was throwing to non-NFL talent there.
He hit everyone in preseason, including all the backups.

PS can I have the Browns +14 on sunday?...friendly challenge of course.

 

[Joe Public]

I not only saw him on TV, I saw him in person, in that very Denver game you discuss.

And I don't think hardly any of Denver's first team defense was in the game at that point. Because Brady came in after halftime. Some of it was out there, I'm pretty sure, but I think the heavyweights in the secondary were gone.

Though I could be wrong.

And don't get me wrong, I saw this guy in person, I am a believer. I just think the only reason you throw him in now is to save your job.

You have a rookie left tackle, who we all saw get beat out there more than once Sunday. You have a line that needs time together. Did Frye bring on some of those sacks like he always does, er, did? Yes. But let's not kid ourselves and say, hey, that line was holding up great for eight seconds before Frye got happy feet and couldn't find anyone.

I like Quinn, I think he's going to be good for this team.

I just think nobody wins if you throw him in before the team is ready and I don't think the team is ready--nor do I think he is.

But obviously that's not my call.

And, no, you can't have 14, because if Quinn does get in (and if DA is on a pitch count he almost assuredly will) I have no idea how that's going to go. Vince Young single-handedly ruined my Tennessee season wins under last year, I'm not going to get into one of those battles with an unknown again.

Oh, last, were I the Browns, I never would have said DA only gets three series, I would have announced him as the starter and told the team, but not the press, to prepare for Brady in the second quarter.

That way the Bengals wouldn't spend as much time looking at his tape as they will DA. But, again, this organization has its head up its *ss so what are ya gonna do.

 

[Gorgolon Lives]

We should see Quinn in around week 6, though Romeo might wait til mid-season at week 8. This team is going no where this season, so they should get Quinn some experience, and make a run next year for a respectable season of .500 football.

 

[gpcyan3]

team is going no where this season, so they should get Quinn some experience, and make a run next year for a respectable season of .500 football.

Very well put Believe.

 

[G-Man]

We should see Quinn in around week 6, though Romeo might wait til mid-season at week 8. This team is going no where this season, so they should get Quinn some experience, and make a run next year for a respectable season of .500 football.

Fans wont wait till week 8. Owners dont want to throw in the towel, thats why they made the move today.

The Browns are in the second softest division, IMO. We'll see what happens. Injuries can kill anyone in the division. The Ravens are cooked if McNair cant play. The bengals have NO 'D",

The Steelers have less talent than last year and the turnovers TOTALLY sent the wrong message to everyone who didnt see the game. It was Cleveland's mistake-prone play that gave Pitt the game.

 

[Joe Public]

Owners dont want to throw in the towel, thats why they made the move today.

This move IS throwing in the towel. Any winning by Quinn this year is gravy. This is Denver and Jay Cutler last year.

You know, just earlier in an attempt by this staff and this GM to save their jobs.

 

[G-Man]

Owners dont want to throw in the towel, thats why they made the move today.

This move IS throwing in the towel. Any winning by Quinn this year is gravy. This is Denver and Jay Cutler last year.

You know, just earlier in an attempt by this staff and this GM to save their jobs.

Phone call, Ring...Riinnngggg. Riiinnnggg.

Hello Bill? Yeah. It's Phil...Phil Savage. Are you ready to coach Cleveland?

Cower:, Sure, give me a five year deal for 50 mill..

Phil: Great, can you be here before noon Sunday?

Cower: Yeah, I'll drive in Saturday night. Talk to Brady and let him know he's my guy...

Phil:, Got it. See ya at the Marriot Downtown. Dinner at 6.

 

[rolub]

My argument for Quinn is not so much of one that he is 100% ready. While not here, I've stated that my only concern is that he knows the playbook and where his guys will be on the field. Obviously the holdout has been counterproductive to this, which is why I want him taking first-team snaps throughout practice this week, and all of next week. No, it's not game experience, but it's the next best thing rather than throwing him out there when it counts.

Also, my argument has always been more against Frye than for Quinn. Last year, they couldn't have put DA in there soon enough in my opinion. I really don't care how great of a field general, accurate passer, etc. Frye was at Akron. That's super. In the NFL, you need to throw to the proper spot on a receiver's body for whatever route he's running, and Frye could never do that. To be honest, it's a surprise to me that he's lasted this long.

As long as DA is starting this week, I'll be teasing the Bengals in as many 2-team teasers as I can. The line in favor of the Bengals should have a 2nd number next to it.

regardless.... GO BROWNS! :cheers: :36_11_6:

 

[G-Man]

My argument for Quinn is not so much of one that he is 100% ready. While not here, I've stated that my only concern is that he knows the playbook and where his guys will be on the field. Obviously the holdout has been counterproductive to this, which is why I want him taking first-team snaps throughout practice this week, and all of next week. No, it's not game experience, but it's the next best thing rather than throwing him out there when it counts.

Also, my argument has always been more against Frye than for Quinn. Last year, they couldn't have put DA in there soon enough in my opinion. I really don't care how great of a field general, accurate passer, etc. Frye was at Akron. That's super. In the NFL, you need to throw to the proper spot on a receiver's body for whatever route he's running, and Frye could never do that. To be honest, it's a surprise to me that he's lasted this long.

As long as DA is starting this week, I'll be teasing the Bengals in as many 2-team teasers as I can. The line in favor of the Bengals should have a 2nd number next to it.

regardless.... GO BROWNS! :cheers: :36_11_6:

Yeah, thats what his problem was, (poor accuracy) and why I want Quinn in there. He lasted this long because they were trying to fix the O-line first to see what they had in Frye. Quinn - when in there - played more effectively even without first string offensive rbs and rec'vrs..

Quinn knows more of the plays than Savage will expose. He made a comment here that the holdout has held the kid back, but I believe he knows plenty and they are being secretive about it publicly. They want their opponents to prepare for DA. It appeared that Quinn mis-read one play in all the preseason snaps. He's two weeks into the season now - and should he happen to get in to play, he will do well. Why not against a piss-poor defense anyway? And, why not while they have a healthy team?

 

[G-Man]

As long as DA is starting this week, I'll be teasing the Bengals in as many 2-team teasers as I can. The line in favor of the Bengals should have a 2nd number next to it.

regardless.... GO BROWNS! :cheers: :36_11_6:

What kind of 2nd number? And why?

 

[rolub]

What kind of 2nd number? And why?

what i meant was, in my opinion, CIN should be a double-digit favorite. but in the end, I'd give the Browns about a 10% chance of winning this ballgame. Hence, teasing Cincy from -6.5 down to -0.5 is winning play with 90% assuredness based on what i've seen and what i know.

 

[Joe Public]

As long as DA is starting this week, I'll be teasing the Bengals in as many 2-team teasers as I can. The line in favor of the Bengals should have a 2nd number next to it.

This is very, very true.

As I mentioned above, I've now seen DA in person and it is frightening. His decisions are not only not very good, but they are far too slow for the NFL and, maybe this comes from being around Frye, but he seems to want to pull the ball down more often than he should.

And, frankly, he should never pull the ball down in the first place because he and his size sixteen feet are not fast.

If you could guarantee he was going to be in there the whole game, Rolub is right, this spread should be at least six points higher and you could feel confident they'd cover it by halftime.