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LIV Tour

Gandolf

Leader of the Van Buren Boys
I wonder why they’re waiting for the Fed Ex Cup??
It's smart, get one last cash grab. It basically ends the PGA Tour season and then there are still 5 LIV events to play in. And I'm sure there is hope that more defections will bring both sides to the bargaining table before the next season starts.
 

Gandolf

Leader of the Van Buren Boys
Field quality this week (OWGR)

PGA in Michigan- #4, #13, #16, #19, #20, #27, #33, #40, #46, #50,
Other names (major winners or Ryder Cup heroes) - Webb, Kuchar, Woodland, Fowler, Day, Glover, Cink

LIV in New Jersey - #17, #22, #23, #25, #30, #31, #34, #36, #41, #45
Other names (major winners or Ryder Cup heroes)- Sergio, Kaymer, McDowell, Mickelson, Poulter, Schwartzel, Westwood
 

Gandolf

Leader of the Van Buren Boys
A couple of notes on World Golf Rankings

- There are 26 professional golf tours that have world golf ranking points and 11 of those tours have at least some 54 hole tournaments that also have ranking points.
- In a typical year about 350 events worldwide offer golf ranking points, including on tours such as the Abema TV Tour, Alps Tour Golf, Big Easy Tour, China Tour, MENA Golf Tour, Nordic Golf League and PGA Tour Series - China.
- This year Harold Varner III earned 50 points by winning the PIF Saudi International powered by SoftBank Investment Advisors, an Asian Tour event that was in earlier years a DP World Tour event.
- Hero World Challenge, a non-FedEx Cup PGA Tour event with a total field of 18 high ranked players, awards 48 points to the winner, more points than offered at the Wyndham Championship or last weeks 3M Open, the same as the AT&T Byron Nelson. and twice the amount of the John Deere Classic.
 

Gandolf

Leader of the Van Buren Boys
Bubba confirmed, will be a captain. Guess they’re keeping it at 48 and shaving off the no names from the minor tours.

If corporations start purchasing or sponsoring teams things could escalate even quicker.
 

DaddyMcIlhon

Well-Known Member
Bubba confirmed, will be a captain. Guess they’re keeping it at 48 and shaving off the no names from the minor tours.

If corporations start purchasing or sponsoring teams things could escalate even quicker.
You know what it’s kinda turning into? A thing where they’re running out of spots….
 

DaddyMcIlhon

Well-Known Member
[Marchand] NEWS: Charles Barkley tells The Post he has ended discussions with LIV and he will stay at TNT.
Guess they didn’t wanna spend 60 million on a guy who’s only golf commentating experience is The Match - which is basically the worst golf event ever produced.
 

Gandolf

Leader of the Van Buren Boys
OWGR is valuable because it holds the most automatic spots for the majors but its not the be all and end all. Only finishing in the top 50 (British Open, Masters) or 60 (US Open) would make a difference, and there are only 10 LIV guys right now who would be affected, and most of them are still qualifying under other majors criteria. The PGA championship will probably be the most difficult to get into in the long haul since it goes with the top 70 money earners on the PGA tour, plus invites Ryder Cup players in the top 100 OWGR.

But the two Opens also provide automatic spots for other tours. They could easily carve out spots for the top LIV players. And they still allow qualifying the old fashioned way. The Masters hasn't been holding spots for other tours but there's nothing to say they couldn't, they do hold spots for international amateurs from different regions. The PGA doesn't recognize anyone outside the PGA of America or PGA Tour except for European Ryder Cup players, so I would think they wouldn't change.

The biggest hurdle the LIV tour has is the continued negative publicity for being tied to Saudi Arabia, which is an obscenely high horse that most in the media choose to ride on SELECTIVELY while choosing to ignore similar ties to sports by other countries (China in particular, Russia, Qatar) or even Saudi ties to other sports (Premier League in particular). The PGA Tour gets an undeserved push in that respect, as they have also made overtures to Saudi Arabia over the years, holding tournaments there.

As far as ratings, I wonder what the PGA Tour ratings are outside the US? LIV is trying to promote itself as a worldwide product, and its being shown in television markets worldwide. I have no idea how that reach is progressing. Youtube being the main vehicle in the US is an obvious disadvantage, but a short term one I am guessing.

Right now the PGA Tour needs to put on an all out media press ahead of their playoffs. But in a few weeks the PGA Tour season ends, we'll what happens then.
 

bones

We Must Protect Our Democracy
LIV is kicking the PGA's ass in court and soon will also do so on the course.

Saw this:

The PGA tour took in $1.5 billion in 2019 - the same year Jay Monahan received compensation of $8.9 million. Had he been a player, his income would have ranked him second on the money list behind Koepka and ahead of Rory.
 

Inspekdah

Friend of CTG
They finally got a good golfer in Cam Smith. But it won’t move the needle. He’s not a very marketable guy with his underbite and mullet. Still don’t know anyone who has watched this yet. They should invest in marketing more.
 

Gandolf

Leader of the Van Buren Boys
I watched the event at Bedminster and some of the last round at Pumpkin Ridge. Agree they need to beef up their marketing.
 

Gandolf

Leader of the Van Buren Boys
The reigning Champion Golfer is a huge get. Especially so with the President's Cup at the end of September. Along with Leishman that's four of the twelve from the 2019 international team that are playing LIV events, With the PGA tour owning the event I'd imagine they won't be invited, which leaves the international team with Matsuyama, Adam Scott, Sungjae Im, Niemann and a bunch of unknowns. Yikes.

Also this puts a real squeeze on the R&A. Would they dare uninvite the Champion Golfer from playing next year? I wouldn't think so. So the qualification requirements stay as is and set the standard for the other majors. PGA Tour loses a chance at additional leverage.
 

B.A.R.

CTG Partner
Staff member
Figured Cam would wait 3 weeks.

As far as Presidents Cup, I'd assume Deki just waiting till after playoffs.
 

B.A.R.

CTG Partner
Staff member
They finally got a good golfer in Cam Smith. But it won’t move the needle. He’s not a very marketable guy with his underbite and mullet. Still don’t know anyone who has watched this yet. They should invest in marketing more.
He's their best get but you are correct.

I've watched 15 mins total. This simply doesn't move the needle for me right now.
 

askias

Well-Known Member
If you started a new tour with Tiger and 49 other guys I never heard of, I’d watch that. This is the reverse of that, and looking forward to the new guys who will be on the PGA Tour next year to replace those who left.
 

B.A.R.

CTG Partner
Staff member
If you started a new tour with Tiger and 49 other guys I never heard of, I’d watch that. This is the reverse of that, and looking forward to the new guys who will be on the PGA Tour next year to replace those who left.
Yepppppppp
 

jedi ninja

Aka Larry
Apparently Cam Smith has signed for $140,000,000 and Cam Young is right behind him.

They've apparently offered Matsuyama, who many expect to be gone after the FedEx playoffs upwards of $400M. They are looking to make an Asian team or have a big Asian component to this in the future, so that makes perfect sense.
 

Gandolf

Leader of the Van Buren Boys
All-star leaderboard in the Fedex Cup playoffs....Duncan, Spaun, Straka, Mullinax, Harman, Merritt.....hoo boy
 

GoDawgs1980

Well-Known Member
Still better than liv
You crazy. LIV's last board was Stenson, Wolff, DJ, Ortiz, Reed, Casey, Garcia, Pettit, Westwood, Gooch, Koepka

Let's compare over the last however many years you want 2,5,10 - the number of wins, majors, top 5s, top 10s in majors vs. the board on the pga tour.
 

B.A.R.

CTG Partner
Staff member
You crazy. LIV's last board was Stenson, Wolff, DJ, Ortiz, Reed, Casey, Garcia, Pettit, Westwood, Gooch, Koepka

Let's compare over the last however many years you want 2,5,10 - the number of wins, majors, top 5s, top 10s in majors vs. the board on the pga tour.
Take away a small field and you can eliminate a few of these guys even being on the leaderboard...

Sergio
Westwood
Stenson
Reed
Wolff

Even Casey with his injuries...

There really isn't anyone on LIV moving the needle at this point. Now, an addition of Cam and some other stars after the playoffs will but there still will not be much depth.

Stenson needed a shortened field and only 54 holes to come out of the shadows after a handful of irrelevant years.

This ain't it bro (LIV golf). It's cheesy and their stars are guys I could care less about. DJ would be a big loss if he cared, but he doesn't. Bryson likely has peaked already and Brooks (a personal fav) had definitely peaked.
 

B.A.R.

CTG Partner
Staff member
The other problem there B is the saturation from Koepka's 3 year run. That really inflates the stats.

This group, as of now, sucks.

They need a bunch of young stars to get this going.
 

GoDawgs1980

Well-Known Member
The other problem there B is the saturation from Koepka's 3 year run. That really inflates the stats.

This group, as of now, sucks.

They need a bunch of young stars to get this going.

It's interesting when you say they do not move the needle. Look at the PIP list and see how many are still there. I think we are also being short-sighted living in the USA; they keep on accumulating talent across the world that does move the needle for those countries. Guys like Reed, and Bryson are not as talented as Scotty, but they are a lot more interesting.

Agree with Brooks. He just cashed in, and realized that his knee might not ever allow him to contend in majors again.

Disagree with Bryson peaking. He's been injured. Gooch would have likely been a contender on the President's Cup if he stayed. Just for the hell of it, Matt Wolff has two top 4s in majors since 2020 (at the age of 21). Hard to say there isn't a lot of talent left in there. I would put his talent up there with Cantlay or Finau and he is substantially younger.
 

GoDawgs1980

Well-Known Member
Also, i hate to say it, but the Tour's demographic that watches week in and week out (like us) is not who they are going after.

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