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Carson Wentz sweepstakes?

Two Utes

Well-Known Member
I’ve even heard some goofball reports of scouts liking Wilson more than lawrence. Dunno if that just smoke screen or stupidity?
It's stupidity. If he goes to a team that he can be groomed he could turn out to be a good QB. If one of these shit teams think he's the answer he'll bust out.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
It's stupidity. If he goes to a team that he can be groomed he could turn out to be a good QB. If one of these shit teams think he's the answer he'll bust out.

yea, I pretty much agree, I certainly don’t think he a savior, maybe a Baker mayfield type. I don’t think there any chance in hell he anywhere close to Lawrence. I think since everyone knows Lawrence gone at 1 they just trying to convince themselves they really want Wilson, knowing damn well if they had 1st pick there wouldn’t be any doubt they take Lawrence.
 

brewers888

Chicken Little
Wilson has all the tools to be great and is easily the second best QB in this draft. If Joe Douglas passes on him and Darnold fails again next season he will be out of a job.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
you way to high on Wilson me thinks. He one them dudes who thinks he more athletic than he really is, it got him in trouble at times playing against mostly weak competition, it gonna be a real problem in the nfl. I don’t think he ever be anything more than average, don’t see him ever being considered a top 10 qb in the league. I’d prob take a chance on Lance without ever having seen him! Lol. Most seem to think he has superstar upside and tools where I’m pretty confident Wilson doesnt.
 

KJ

Reformed
you way to high on Wilson me thinks. He one them dudes who thinks he more athletic than he really is, it got him in trouble at times playing against mostly weak competition, it gonna be a real problem in the nfl. I don’t think he ever be anything more than average, don’t see him ever being considered a top 10 qb in the league. I’d prob take a chance on Lance without ever having seen him! Lol. Most seem to think he has superstar upside and tools where I’m pretty confident Wilson doesnt.
Yeah it's really a pretty weak QB draft outside of Trevor because the rest will go to desperate teams and even if NE finds their way into something that guy will have no one to pass to. Lance is the one I'd take hoping that the upside is there but it isn't happening in the first couple years.
 

guaranteeed

CTG Moderator
Staff member
you way to high on Wilson me thinks. He one them dudes who thinks he more athletic than he really is, it got him in trouble at times playing against mostly weak competition, it gonna be a real problem in the nfl. I don’t think he ever be anything more than average, don’t see him ever being considered a top 10 qb in the league. I’d prob take a chance on Lance without ever having seen him! Lol. Most seem to think he has superstar upside and tools where I’m pretty confident Wilson doesnt.
Ya, if your a team like the jets, or many others, who arent just a qb away, I'd much rather take lance, who is maybe a bit riskier with a lower floor, but his ceilings way higher

Worst case is you're back in the same spot in the next few years and can grab howell or DJ

Like cards with Rosen into kyler
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
You're smoking the good stuff if you think he'll be better than Kenny O'Brien

I almost wrote “look out Pennington and obrien” but I wasn’t 100% sure that was the right guy so I left him off. Thought I remembered having some cheap crappy football cards with a obrien on jets! Lol
 
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2daBank

VC's Valentine
The Jets only two choices are Wilson and Darnold. The other QBs in this draft besides of course Lawrence are terrible.

I just dunno how you can be so sure? Nobody knows, especially with a guy like Lance it damn near impossible to have any sort of educated opinion about. Pretty sure nobody was talking up Brady who split time at Michigan! Russ Wilson wasn’t incredibly well thought of. Shoot, just recently we had a team draft Mitch trubisky ahead of mahomes and watson! It’s fun to have opinions on these kids but you talk so definitively when we know this a damn near impossible task even for ppl and whole departments who make a lot of money doing it!

I don’t think Zach Wilson has a very good chance to ever be a elite franchise qb so I think if that the case better off taking a shot with a kid like Lance who lots of ppl have said has that kind of potential. I could be dead wrong, it happens plenty and seeing how I have never even seen Lance play the chances prob even greater but I rather go out swinging for the fences than settling for the “safe” choice who prob more nfl ready but I don’t think ever be more than average at best.

I guess the problem for jets is it sounds like Lance probably be better off sitting most his 1st year but jets don’t have a vet he can sit behind and learn from. I think it fair to say Wilson more ready to be thrown in, just don’t think it will go well if he is!!! All the more reason I think if you telling me it between Wilson or keeping Darnold I’d stay with Sam.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
Ya, if your a team like the jets, or many others, who arent just a qb away, I'd much rather take lance, who is maybe a bit riskier with a lower floor, but his ceilings way higher

Worst case is you're back in the same spot in the next few years and can grab howell or DJ

Like cards with Rosen into kyler

no risk it, no biscuit. I agree with you, give me the upside of the unknown kid over one I never see being great. Only thing is like I mentioned above, it be better to have a vet like teddy B to groom a kid like Lance who probably be better off sitting and learning for awhile.

I don’t think many teams have the guts to move off a high pick as quickly as the cardinals did. Maybe it working out for them will influence others to do it but not something I ever recall seeing, I was surprised they did it. Kinda feels like fish might be considering doing the same thing w Tua.
 
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KJ

Reformed
no risk it, no biscuit. I agree with you, give me the upside of the unknown kid over one I never see being great. Only thing is like I mentioned above, it be better to have a vet like teddy B to groom a kid like Lance who probably be better off sitting and learning for awhile.

I don’t think many teams have the guts to move off a high pick as quickly as the cardinals did. Maybe it working out for them will influence others to do it but not something I ever recall seeing, I was surprised they did it. Kinda feels like fish might be considering doing the same thing w Tua.
It's a testament to how quick turnover is anymore and how many years an organization is willing to hang to head coaches, who can be trendy, or QBs who at best are 50/50 as first round picks to be worth a damn thing by the end of their rookie contracts other than backups. Coach/QB gotta be on the same page win or lose right out of college, even if they're holding clipboards the first year or two.
 

brewers888

Chicken Little
I just dunno how you can be so sure? Nobody knows, especially with a guy like Lance it damn near impossible to have any sort of educated opinion about. Pretty sure nobody was talking up Brady who split time at Michigan! Russ Wilson wasn’t incredibly well thought of. Shoot, just recently we had a team draft Mitch trubisky ahead of mahomes and watson! It’s fun to have opinions on these kids but you talk so definitively when we know this a damn near impossible task even for ppl and whole departments who make a lot of money doing it!

I don’t think Zach Wilson has a very good chance to ever be a elite franchise qb so I think if that the case better off taking a shot with a kid like Lance who lots of ppl have said has that kind of potential. I could be dead wrong, it happens plenty and seeing how I have never even seen Lance play the chances prob even greater but I rather go out swinging for the fences than settling for the “safe” choice who prob more nfl ready but I don’t think ever be more than average at best.

I guess the problem for jets is it sounds like Lance probably be better off sitting most his 1st year but jets don’t have a vet he can sit behind and learn from. I think it fair to say Wilson more ready to be thrown in, just don’t think it will go well if he is!!! All the more reason I think if you telling me it between Wilson or keeping Darnold I’d stay with Sam.
I’ve watched enough highlights from Lance to not want him. In the 10 minutes I watched he runs on nearly all of them or when he throws it’s a jump ball downfield. He is a complete project.

As for Wilson vs Darnold I think Wilson is the more talented guy. If they pass on him in favor of Darnold the GM has to live or do by the play of Darnold. The next draft is very weak so if you don’t pick Wilson at 2 you are mortgaging your future on the success of the QB already in the building. If I’m betting my reputation I’m doing it with Wilson under center.

What QBs have been as consistently bad for 3 years as Darnold has been and turned it around completely. He is still extremely young so it’s possible but he has been awful nearly his whole career and the blame can’t go exclusively to Gase.
 

KJ

Reformed
I’ve watched enough highlights from Lance to not want him. In the 10 minutes I watched he runs on nearly all of them or when he throws it’s a jump ball downfield. He is a complete project.

As for Wilson vs Darnold I think Wilson is the more talented guy. If they pass on him in favor of Darnold the GM has to live or do by the play of Darnold. The next draft is very weak so if you don’t pick Wilson at 2 you are mortgaging your future on the success of the QB already in the building. If I’m betting my reputation I’m doing it with Wilson under center.

What QBs have been as consistently bad for 3 years as Darnold has been and turned it around completely. He is still extremely young so it’s possible but he has been awful nearly his whole career and the blame can’t go exclusively to Gase.
10 minutes of highlights this is perfect! :biglaugh:
 

KJ

Reformed
Also brewers, I don't just blame Gase, I blame Woody and the FANS

Just get out of dodge fast, your life will be happier starting tomorrow
 

brewers888

Chicken Little
Also brewers, I don't just blame Gase, I blame Woody and the FANS

Just get out of dodge fast, your life will be happier starting tomorrow
So Darnold has sucked because of the idiot owner and the mean fans. I hate Jets ownership as much as anyone but they haven’t made the QB play terribly over three years.
 

brewers888

Chicken Little
I’m still waiting for someone to give me an example of a QB that was as statistically awful as Darnold has been his first three years that turned it around and became a very good starter.
 

KJ

Reformed
So Darnold has sucked because of the idiot owner and the mean fans. I hate Jets ownership as much as anyone but they haven’t made the QB play terribly over three years.
Mean fans don't help I guess, although in that market it would prolly suck. I doubt he's been really ruined by that. He's been ruined by lack of leadership.

However, put yourself in his shoes. You're on a team that has zero. You try to roll in to work poz daily, but losers act like losers all over. If you don't think atmosphere (and I don't give 2 fks about Covid for this sake). I hope the dude goes elsewhere...seems like a lost talent sunk in the abyss of shitty ownership, shitty leadership, shitty fan base. I wouldn't want to put much effort into inspiring hope after a few minutes around that operation.
 

brewers888

Chicken Little
Mean fans don't help I guess, although in that market it would prolly suck. I doubt he's been really ruined by that. He's been ruined by lack of leadership.

However, put yourself in his shoes. You're on a team that has zero. You try to roll in to work poz daily, but losers act like losers all over. If you don't think atmosphere (and I don't give 2 fks about Covid for this sake). I hope the dude goes elsewhere...seems like a lost talent sunk in the abyss of shitty ownership, shitty leadership, shitty fan base. I wouldn't want to put much effort into inspiring hope after a few minutes around that operation.
I hope he becomes successful but I would be surprised if he turns it around with this franchise.
 

VirginiaCavs

Man Crush on Kyle Guy
I’m still waiting for someone to give me an example of a QB that was as statistically awful as Darnold has been his first three years that turned it around and became a very good starter.

Sam‘s first three years vs Tanny‘s first three...fairly comparable in terms of passer rating.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I’ve watched enough highlights from Lance to not want him. In the 10 minutes I watched he runs on nearly all of them or when he throws it’s a jump ball downfield. He is a complete project.

As for Wilson vs Darnold I think Wilson is the more talented guy. If they pass on him in favor of Darnold the GM has to live or do by the play of Darnold. The next draft is very weak so if you don’t pick Wilson at 2 you are mortgaging your future on the success of the QB already in the building. If I’m betting my reputation I’m doing it with Wilson under center.

What QBs have been as consistently bad for 3 years as Darnold has been and turned it around completely. He is still extremely young so it’s possible but he has been awful nearly his whole career and the blame can’t go exclusively to Gase.

tannenhill with Gase then without? I think we can point directly to Gase combined with lack of talent around him. I’ve seen enough plays/throws Darnold has made to believe he has more than enough athleticism and arm talent to succeed. Appears to me it 100% the mental side of Darnolds game that needs correcting and I think that falls directly on Gase. I wouldn’t normally put it all on the coach but we have seen it with the last young QB Gase was responsible for developing!

As you said Darnold is still very young (23 I believe?), he came in young and much like tannenhill didn’t get a ton of experience in college only starting the 1 season. So while you might be correct about not many QBs having 3 bad seasons before busting out, not many have started so much at such a young age and without the benefit of more playing time in college. So he didn’t get much tutoring at the college level then he gets thrown into starting behind a bad oline and having a garbage coach!!

Personally I just don’t look at Wilson and see more talent, I actually think darnold is more talented and he has already been thru the inevitable growing pains pretty much every young qb goes thru. You still have him on his rookie deal for this season then the 5th year option for the following season (if they pick it up, I dunno how that works far as when they gotta decide on that?). I rather trade back a handful of spots and take a stud like Pitts from Florida to give him a instant weapon better than any he has had! Along with adding another good pick or 2 to help fill out a weak roster! I just don’t believe Darnold gonna be so bad he gets anyone fired, if they put a good team and system around him he will be fine at worst.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
You throw Wilson in against all these tough defenses in the afc east and it will be a disaster imo. His overconfidence in his athleticism will be exposed very quickly!
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
Wilson will make Sanchez look like the future

even with pats decline they gonna get opt outs back on the D and hoody has always been a nightmare for young QBs! Those 2 games would be bad! Miami’s defense wouldn’t be any easier for him, neither would the bills who just need a stronger pass rush. Those 6 games would be turnover fest imo.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I don’t ever recall seeing a tight end in top 10 but I would absolutely draft Pitts in the top 10. He looks like a no brainer lock to be a elite te.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
Unfortunately I have to know Iowa sports for family reasons lol

hockerson turning out pretty good but he ain’t like Kelce or healthy kittle class. I think Pitts could end up challenging those 2 for best in the league. Hell, I think he walks in and is a top 5 guy right away. I dunno if he can block or not? Don’t think that as important for te’s these days but still nice to have one that can! Having a big time te is right up there in terms of things that can help a young qb a great deal. Wonder why they not valued higher in general? It’s not like we have a abundance of great ones, it actually a pretty thin position overall imo.
 

KJ

Reformed
hockerson turning out pretty good but he ain’t like Kelce or healthy kittle class. I think Pitts could end up challenging those 2 for best in the league. Hell, I think he walks in and is a top 5 guy right away. I dunno if he can block or not? Don’t think that as important for te’s these days but still nice to have one that can! Having a big time te is right up there in terms of things that can help a young qb a great deal. Wonder why they not valued higher in general?
Blocking is for your TE2 anymore. ISU just hoping Kolar doesn't declare last I heard
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
Blocking is for your TE2 anymore. ISU just hoping Kolar doesn't declare last I heard

true, it is a huge bonus if they can block tho! At least serviceable enough that teams gotta respect run possibility to his side the field!! I don’t recall ever seeing him block so I have no clue if he can? Lol. Don’t think you would ever keep him in to pass protect as he be one the best hot reads possible.
 
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