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Carson Wentz sweepstakes?

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I think it was a decent trade for them. Who knows if wentz rebounds? It’s still a risk. They certainly weren’t getting a stafford type return. Jury still out on Hurts but I think he showed enough for optimism

there obviously a ton of question marks on Wentz which why there wasn’t much interest in him, that said anytime you trade away a guy you drafted with what the 2nd pick? (I forget, didn’t they have to trade up also? Memory hazy on that.) From a few years ago for a 3rd and future conditional 2nd/late 1st you can’t have done anything but set the franchise back imo.

Simply put they butchered things with him and then didn’t do themselves any favors benching Hurts in the Washington game. That can probably be repaired since pederson gone, I assume they can pin that all on him cause I think it was.

It appears they headed in the complete wrong direction, the Oline has aged and falling apart, looks to me like they screwed up their 1st rounder last year taking a wr who doesn’t look to be nearly as good as some others (that could change, used to be it took wrs a year and this past one was probably harder than most), they have a lot of holes and now a strange hire at head coach. I’m really not sure at all bout Hurts being a franchise qb? he did do some good things but think that coulda been a product of teams having not seen him or the way they ran the offense with him at qb. Either way it another huge question mark on a team full of them!! I have heard they might draft another qb this year, I would if there one at 6 they like. Maybe they luck out and another team loves a player in their spot and they able to move back and get some more picks? That might be the best thing for them with lots of holes to fill.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I think Pitt should have made a move on him. Think he’d have been a fit there and they could move on from Ben

lot of teams not sure if wentz can bounce back, especially had he got traded somewhere he didn’t want to go! We have already seen he has incredibly thin skin. I don’t think steelers really in a position they could afford to take a risk on a guy owed a lot of money next few years. They already have a huge cap hit with ben this year and lot of other issues that need to be addressed while being over the cap!

Besides the money risk even tho we look at the 3rd and then the conditional pick in ‘22 colts gave up as a small price steelers pretty good at finding certain positions at those spots and they need a influx of cost controlled talent. They gotta fix that run game, I think wentz will work in Indy but have my doubts he would have worked in a lot of places, especially with a team that has lot of other issues.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
Wentz is in mvp convo next year.

What a steal

maybe, the problem for Philly was he wouldn’t have been that with them or a lot of other teams so there just wasn’t a market. Guy was a total pain in the ass for them, he let it be known he wouldn’t have been happy in Chicago so that obviously scared them out the picture. He didn’t have a official no trade clause but he might as well have. Nobody gonna take a risk on damaged goods who coming out and essentially sayin those teams he didn’t like would be getting the same crappy player he was in Philly last year!! The power shift going on in the nfl is real, lol.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
Totally agree. Behind that OL not having to worry about being hit in 3 sec on every play, and w those weapons. Sheesh. Not happy as a titans fan

colts are loaded for a SB run, if they get him back to being the guy he was they the afc favs imo!! Hell, they pretty much outplayed the bills in that playoff game with old man rivers. Had they had his running ability down at the goalline they mosh likely cash in a few more chances. That is of course if they can get him to stop turning it over!
 

Big daddy naught

Well-Known Member
colts are loaded for a SB run, if they get him back to being the guy he was they the afc favs imo!! Hell, they pretty much outplayed the bills in that playoff game with old man rivers. Had they had his running ability down at the goalline they mosh likely cash in a few more chances. That is of course if they can get him to stop turning it over!
He won’t turn it over as much bc he has guys who can get open and catch the ball and will have time to scan the field
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
Market was pretty limited for Carson which I think is crazy. Sure he had a shit year but that whole offense was a mess, injuries to the OL and WRs. Low risk, high reward for indy. Worth taking a shot on him than other available QBs unless they were getting Watson which wasn’t gonna happen.

ive probably said this already but it was just a very odd situation. He was absolutely worth the risk for the colts and it will probably pay off big, but even if it doesn’t colts are in such a great place they can move off him in 2 years and not be any worse off for it (assuming he doesn’t divide and ruin the locker room like been rumored in Philly! Lol).

There just wernt a lot of teams in that kind of position. Credit to colts for being so well run that they were, it was impressive how they got this done for so cheap! They were willing to get outbid and go another way so they stuck to their guns and got a steal! Most the crappy run teams woulda got desperate and overpaid for a guy they coveted. That why colts are in the position they are, they don’t do such things!!

Certainly didn’t hurt the colts chances that it was pretty well known where he wanted to go. As I said wentz might as well had a no trade clause cause who in their right mind would take the risk on him knowing they were likely to get the same unhappy whiner who was in Philly?
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
Anyone know what colts SB future was and where it is now after the move?? Gotta figure it jumped them right up into bills price range, like right behind the chiefs?
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
how much of a cap hit is wentz still gonna be for Philly this year? And is this the last year or is there more dead cap money in ‘22 cause of how it was structured?
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
Like clockwork Eagles now saying Hurts will have to compete for starting job. While I dont blame them it sure seems like they have a knack of alienating their qb!!
 

brewers888

Chicken Little
Like clockwork Eagles now saying Hurts will have to compete for starting job. While I dont blame them it sure seems like they have a knack of alienating their qb!!
That team isn't winning anything with Jalen Hurts at QB. They should trade their first round pick to the Jets for Darnold once they've commited to Wilson at 2.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
That team isn't winning anything with Jalen Hurts at QB. They should trade their first round pick to the Jets for Darnold once they've commited to Wilson at 2.

i don’t really buy Hurts either, that said I still don’t think they outta be going out of their way to alienate another qb. What they did to him in last game was bad enough. Doesn’t seem like they learned much from wentz. Lol.

someone will get darnold but I doubt it be Philly, hope not for his sake, poor kid will never have a chance to succeed. 1st he gets screwed with known qb ruiner Gase then he gets shipped to the train wreck Philly turning into? That would suck!!

I still think Darnold could be a good qb in this league. I don’t even think he needs to be coddled like wentz, jets should get more for him than Eagles got. I know you have a little crush on wilson but I’m not convinced he better than Darnold. I’d love to see Darnold end up with the niners, Jimmy g just hurt way too often and Shanny clearly has never fully trusted him, they went out of their way to limit his impact during the playoff run, then the one play they needed him to make in SB he didn’t! Ive heard a bunch of times niners liked Darnold going all way back to year he was drafted, if jets have decided they moving on and drafting Wilson I think that be a great fit! No clue what the market like for him or the asking price be? I’d think he worth a late 1 or a couple 2s and maybe a starter. He still has a year or 2 on his rookie deal then the 5th year option correct? That in itself makes him more valuable far as asking price.
 
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2daBank

VC's Valentine
We still got a handful of teams left needing QBs who won’t be able to get any the 4 or 5 projected to go in 1st round this year. From everything I have heard there not much in way of qb prospects coming out in ‘22, I’m sure a few will emerge but not a great class. That should make Darnold that much more valuable to the teams who can’t land one of this years rookies.
 

Johnnyonthespot

CTG Regular
I had crushes on Reich and Pederson. The Redskins game broke me, and many on him. His arrogance is next level, but he is a genius. Reich started going SJW last year and it made me lose faith in him.

Eagles crashed so hard Luries head is still spinning.

I never heard specifically what Carson did outside his play on field that made him a bad teammate? Fill me in.

Wentz is the antithesis of ESPN hero. They hate people of faith and bash them instinctively like dogs.

Wentz has been surrounded my mediocre talent and untrustworthy leadership.

Football locker rooms benefit with Wentz types. It dont work in NBA locker rooms.

Colts and Titans are legit. Top to bottom. Cant wait.
 
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2daBank

VC's Valentine
What the Fuck are the Patriots doing? They don’t seem to have any plan at qb! Their roster starting to get ugly, they have by far the least talented skill position players in the league!! Never would have thought they go in tank like they appear to be headed! I don’t see anything to be excited about in New England! What a shame! Lol
 

brewers888

Chicken Little
i don’t really buy Hurts either, that said I still don’t think they outta be going out of their way to alienate another qb. What they did to him in last game was bad enough. Doesn’t seem like they learned much from wentz. Lol.

someone will get darnold but I doubt it be Philly, hope not for his sake, poor kid will never have a chance to succeed. 1st he gets screwed with known qb ruiner Gase then he gets shipped to the train wreck Philly turning into? That would suck!!

I still think Darnold could be a good qb in this league. I don’t even think he needs to be coddled like wentz, jets should get more for him than Eagles got. I know you have a little crush on wilson but I’m not convinced he better than Darnold. I’d love to see Darnold end up with the niners, Jimmy g just hurt way too often and Shanny clearly has never fully trusted him, they went out of their way to limit his impact during the playoff run, then the one play they needed him to make in SB he didn’t! Ive heard a bunch of times niners liked Darnold going all way back to year he was drafted, if jets have decided they moving on and drafting Wilson I think that be a great fit! No clue what the market like for him or the asking price be? I’d think he worth a late 1 or a couple 2s and maybe a starter. He still has a year or 2 on his rookie deal then the 5th year option correct? That in itself makes him more valuable far as asking price.
I am ok with either keeping Darnold or drafting Wilson but I am done supporting this franchise if they pick Fields. I think they will end up picking Wilson and getting a mid to late first rounder for Darnold which is probably the best scenario both for the team and Darnold who needs a fresh start with a competent organization.
 

brewers888

Chicken Little
What the Fuck are the Patriots doing? They don’t seem to have any plan at qb! Their roster starting to get ugly, they have by far the least talented skill position players in the league!! Never would have thought they go in tank like they appear to be headed! I don’t see anything to be excited about in New England! What a shame! Lol
Jimmy G will end up in New England. Bellichick wanted to trade Brady to SF instead of Jimmy but was overrruled by Kraft.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I am ok with either keeping Darnold or drafting Wilson but I am done supporting this franchise if they pick Fields. I think they will end up picking Wilson and getting a mid to late first rounder for Darnold which is probably the best scenario both for the team and Darnold who needs a fresh start with a competent organization.

I just think they be better served w darnold and trading the 2nd but you probably right. No way they take fields, there ton of Wilson hype going around, pretty sure he the 2nd qb taken.
 

KJ

Reformed
I am ok with either keeping Darnold or drafting Wilson but I am done supporting this franchise if they pick Fields. I think they will end up picking Wilson and getting a mid to late first rounder for Darnold which is probably the best scenario both for the team and Darnold who needs a fresh start with a competent organization.
Not a competent org but easily could see WFT going for Darnold, maybe Carolina as well
 

brewers888

Chicken Little
I just think they be better served w darnold and trading the 2nd but you probably right. No way they take fields, there ton of Wilson hype going around, pretty sure he the 2nd qb taken.
I can really go either way but I think Darnold needs a change of scenery. I like Sam and hope he does well so it would be great to see him land in San Francisco.
 

Johnnyonthespot

CTG Regular
I think Zach Wilson is fragile, flamboyant, and annoying.

BYU was mostly men against boys this year.

He throws it up, its caught ez pz.

There is 1 QB that is the future in the NFL.

His name again is Trey Lance.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I can really go either way but I think Darnold needs a change of scenery. I like Sam and hope he does well so it would be great to see him land in San Francisco.

wouldnt the coaching changes equate to same thing? Not like he has a whole locker room hating him like Wentz had in Philly!! I don’t see much reason why he still couldn’t work in NY? Obviously think he have a better chance of success with a team like niners who have a great offensive coach and are stacked. Not sure if they gonna move off Jimmy g or not? I don’t think I’d want to go into another season with him, mostly cause he always freaking hurt. That team ready to roll, they just need a qb they can count on!

The thing for me is if the jets can get a nice haul for the 2nd pick along with the picks they got from the adams trade they could be loaded after the next 2 drafts assuming they draft well! Looks like they did good with that tackle last year, they need another lineman and some weapons now. Guess I’m just not sold on Zach Wilson being all that much better than darnold (if at all) so why not build a team around the guy you have? Imo sticking with darnold would speed up the rebuild.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I think Zach Wilson is fragile, flamboyant, and annoying.

BYU was mostly men against boys this year.

He throws it up, its caught ez pz.

There is 1 QB that is the future in the NFL.

His name again is Trey Lance.

I was with you right up until you said Lance instead of Lawrence! Lol. I got no clue about Lance, think it pretty hard for anyone to know on him but Lawrence a lock imo.
 

brewers888

Chicken Little
wouldnt the coaching changes equate to same thing? Not like he has a whole locker room hating him like Wentz had in Philly!! I don’t see much reason why he still couldn’t work in NY? Obviously think he have a better chance of success with a team like niners who have a great offensive coach and are stacked. Not sure if they gonna move off Jimmy g or not? I don’t think I’d want to go into another season with him, mostly cause he always freaking hurt. That team ready to roll, they just need a qb they can count on!

The thing for me is if the jets can get a nice haul for the 2nd pick along with the picks they got from the adams trade they could be loaded after the next 2 drafts assuming they draft well! Looks like they did good with that tackle last year, they need another lineman and some weapons now. Guess I’m just not sold on Zach Wilson being all that much better than darnold (if at all) so why not build a team around the guy you have? Imo sticking with darnold would speed up the rebuild.
I don't think much of this new coaching staff so I doubt they will do much with Darnold. In my opinion Wilson has more upside than Darnold and its the direction I would go.

If I owned the team I would make it clear to the GM that you either pick Wilson or Darnold is the QB as long as you have your job. The next draft is incredibly weak at QB so Wilson should be the pick. If it was my job on the line I would bet it on Wilson over Darnold.
 

KJ

Reformed
I don't think much of this new coaching staff so I doubt they will do much with Darnold. In my opinion Wilson has more upside than Darnold and its the direction I would go.

If I owned the team I would make it clear to the GM that you either pick Wilson or Darnold is the QB as long as you have your job. The next draft is incredibly weak at QB so Wilson should be the pick. If it was my job on the line I would bet it on Wilson over Darnold.
Woody gives us Johnsons a terrible name. Just sayin'
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I don't think much of this new coaching staff so I doubt they will do much with Darnold. In my opinion Wilson has more upside than Darnold and its the direction I would go.

If I owned the team I would make it clear to the GM that you either pick Wilson or Darnold is the QB as long as you have your job. The next draft is incredibly weak at QB so Wilson should be the pick. If it was my job on the line I would bet it on Wilson over Darnold.

we agree next year doesn’t appear to offer much, we disagree on Wilson over darnold. I just don’t think Darnold upside is gone just cause he had the misfortune of starting his career with one the worst coaches possible and very little talent around him! I think darnold has a lot of talent and what is he 23? Really just comes down to what you can get for the 2nd pick compared to darnold? I think you can probably build a winner behind either guy even if I am little more skeptical on Wilson.

I dunno who jets have on the staff outside the HC hire? Who they bring in as OC and qb coach?
 

brewers888

Chicken Little
we agree next year doesn’t appear to offer much, we disagree on Wilson over darnold. I just don’t think Darnold upside is gone just cause he had the misfortune of starting his career with one the worst coaches possible and very little talent around him! I think darnold has a lot of talent and what is he 23? Really just comes down to what you can get for the 2nd pick compared to darnold? I think you can probably build a winner behind either guy even if I am little more skeptical on Wilson.

I dunno who jets have on the staff outside the HC hire? Who they bring in as OC and qb coach?
I would make it clear to the GM that its his decision and if he wants to bet his career on Darnold thats his call.

The Jets OC is Mike LaFleur the brother of the Packers coach. The Packers guy does not impress me at all so I have little in the way of expectations for anyone with that last name.
 

KJ

Reformed
I would make it clear to the GM that its his decision and if he wants to bet his career on Darnold thats his call.

The Jets OC is Mike LaFleur the brother of the Packers coach. The Packers guy does not impress me at all so I have little in the way of expectations for anyone with that last name.
Pretty sure LaFleur is French for The Flower

What's not inspiring about that?
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I would make it clear to the GM that its his decision and if he wants to bet his career on Darnold thats his call.

The Jets OC is Mike LaFleur the brother of the Packers coach. The Packers guy does not impress me at all so I have little in the way of expectations for anyone with that last name.

I think packers coach is a excellent play designer. Still no clue why the hell he choose to kick a fg with 2 min left in nfc championship tho.
 

Johnnyonthespot

CTG Regular
I was with you right up until you said Lance instead of Lawrence! Lol. I got no clue about Lance, think it pretty hard for anyone to know on him but Lawrence a lock imo.

I love Lawerence. He is bright, he loves football and his teammates. However, his team was mostly men verse boys for majority of games. He also gets injured, some dudes just do and some just dont. The reason Lawerence will be first pick in the draft is because most GMs are weak when it comes down to making a ballsy choice, they are risk averse and will bow to conventional wisdom.

Trey Lance is a physical monster. I draft Fields second. I'm starting to think that sunshine wont be durable. All shitty teams have shitty OLs. Trey on the other hand will be giving out the hits.
 
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KJ

Reformed
I love Lawerence. He is bright, he loves football and his teammates. However, his team was mostly men verse boys for majority of games. He also gets injured, some dudes just do and some just dont. The reason Lawerence will be first pick in the draft is because most GMs are weak when it comes down to making a ballsy choice, they are risk averse and will bow to conventional wisdom.

Trey Lance is a physical monster. I draft Fields second. I'm starting to think that sunshine just isn't durable. All shitty teams have shitty OLs. Trey on the other hand will be giving out the hits.
Especially how the NFL is headed, pocket passers are basically dinosaurs
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I love Lawerence. He is bright, he loves football and his teammates. However, his team was mostly men verse boys for majority of games. He also gets injured, some dudes just do and some just dont. The reason Lawerence will be first pick in the draft is because most GMs are weak when it comes down to making a ballsy choice, they are risk averse and will bow to conventional wisdom.

Trey Lance is a physical monster. I draft Fields second. I'm starting to think that sunshine wont be durable. All shitty teams have shitty OLs. Trey on the other hand will be giving out the hits.

bro, cmon. The reason Lawrence will go 1st cause he rates up there with Elway and luck when it comes to one the best prospects at the position! Far as him playing w men vs boys he at least playing against other nfl level players, Wilson and Lance never have. Lawrence frame is better than all the others. Dunno bout injury prone, I’ve never really heard that with him.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
Especially how the NFL is headed, pocket passers are basically dinosaurs

lawrence is athletic and has shown plenty of scramble ability. I don’t buy pocket QBs being dinosaurs anyways. The guy who keeps winning SB’s is a freaking statue! We keep being told you gotta have a mobile qb yet Brady keeps winning all the rings!
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I’ll take the ability to read defenses and get the ball out quick over a guy with wheels any day. Obviously it a nice luxury to have both but if ya gotta take 1 I don’t think it debatable which skills translate more to winning. There will always be a place for pocket QBs imo. Being atheistic enough to pick up 1st downs with your legs and/or run around in backfield to extend plays probably gives young guys a better chance to have success early but I think the narrative your qb has to be able to scramble is greatly exaggerated.
 

KJ

Reformed
Writing is on the wall...better to predict it than live on stats and the past. The game evolves as do we all, living on a recipe is the difference between Parcells and Hoody
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I actually think some these guys hurting themselves because their ability to take off. I’d like to see Murray run a lot less. Of course that coach needs to do a better job establishing a running game that doesn’t rely so heavily on him!
 

brewers888

Chicken Little
lawrence is athletic and has shown plenty of scramble ability. I don’t buy pocket QBs being dinosaurs anyways. The guy who keeps winning SB’s is a freaking statue! We keep being told you gotta have a mobile qb yet Brady keeps winning all the rings!
I’m all for a QB having some mobility but if he isn’t good at throwing the football I want no part of him. Lawrence and Wilson are both mobile and elite passers vs the other two who are run first guys with limited passing skills.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I’m all for a QB having some mobility but if he isn’t good at throwing the football I want no part of him. Lawrence and Wilson are both mobile and elite passers vs the other two who are run first guys with limited passing skills.

I have no clue about Lance passing ability. I’m not sure fields a run 1st guy? Anytime I’ve watched him he seemed like he was mainly looking to throw 1st.
 

brewers888

Chicken Little
I have no clue about Lance passing ability. I’m not sure fields a run 1st guy? Anytime I’ve watched him he seemed like he was mainly looking to throw 1st.
Fields is a one read guy who doesn’t know how to read a defense. He has as much chance of being a successful QB in the NFL as Terrell Pryor did.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
Fields is a one read guy who doesn’t know how to read a defense. He has as much chance of being a successful QB in the NFL as Terrell Pryor did.

ive heard the one read thing more than once about him. He appeared to scan the field and throw to 2nd-3rd reads in the clemson game.

Could it be a situation where he knew against most the big10 if his 1st read wasn’t there he could do more damage simply taking off? So it not that he can’t progress down his reads as much as running was the best 2nd read for the offense? I dunno if that true or not, just seems like a possibility. As I’ve said many times I honestly don’t have a good feel for whether he a franchise qb or not?

Big10 isn’t a conf I watch a great deal of compared to the other power 5’s and osu games less than some the others. Typically their games have big spreads (which I rarely bet) plus their games get out of hand quick so never much interest watching them.

Surely he a better prospect than Hurts? Judging from your post I think you decided on him really early and not much that could change your opinion. Not knocking it, I’m that way after watching lot of guys just a few times. He isn’t one I feel like I have any idea about to say either way. I think his arm plenty strong enough to make all the throws. That never been a good indicator of whether a guy can succeed tho, just means he has a better chance than someone who can’t. I’d hate to gamble my job on him like someone sure to do in top 5.
 
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brewers888

Chicken Little
ive heard the one read thing more than once about him. He appeared to scan the field and throw to 2nd-3rd reads in the clemson game.

Could it be a situation where he knew against most the big10 if his 1st read wasn’t there he could do more damage simply taking off? So it not that he can’t progress down his reads as much as running was the best 2nd read for the offense? I dunno if that true or not, just seems like a possibility. As I’ve said many times I honestly don’t have a good feel for whether he a franchise qb or not?

Big10 isn’t a conf I watch a great deal of compared to the other power 5’s and osu games less than some the others. Typically their games have big spreads (which I rarely bet) plus their games get out of hand quick so never much interest watching them.

Surely he a better prospect than Hurts? Judging from your post I think you decided on him really early and not much that could change your opinion. Not knocking it, I’m that way after watching lot of guys just a few times. He isn’t one I feel like I have any idea about to say either way. I think his arm plenty strong enough to make all the throws. That never been a good indicator of whether a guy can succeed tho, just means he has a better chance than someone who can’t. I’d hate to gamble my job on him like someone sure to do in top 5.
I've watched Fields more than enough to know he will be a failure. If the Jets make the inexcusable decision to draft him I can walk away from being a fan of the team.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I've watched Fields more than enough to know he will be a failure. If the Jets make the inexcusable decision to draft him I can walk away from being a fan of the team.

no chance they draft him I don’t think. Wilson has gained a lot of steam, pretty sure he be the 2nd qb off.
 

2daBank

VC's Valentine
I’ve even heard some goofball reports of scouts liking Wilson more than lawrence. Dunno if that just smoke screen or stupidity?
 

brewers888

Chicken Little
I’ve even heard some goofball reports of scouts liking Wilson more than lawrence. Dunno if that just smoke screen or stupidity?
I'm talking myself into it but thats because the Jets had the number one pick right there and screwed it up by winning. I do think he is a solid consolation prize so I will go with that for now.
 
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